After you have cast in with the pva bag you will have time before the pva melts to tighten right up to the lead and then give the line a sharp pull so the tip drops back and the rig straightens on the bottom.

The bomb will need to be moved once its landed on the bottom of the lake to straighten the hook length out. If thats what your aiming to do. The hook length will follow the bomb down to the lake bottom and settle vey close to the bomb after the cast. Having the hook length straightened out is not an advantage if a fish picks up your hook bait and swims towards you. In fact, its a disadvantage! Many of the bites when using the cone show up on the tip as a tap, tap, tap, rocking movement on the tip. If the hook lengh is straightened out the fish has got to swim twice as fare as the length of the hook length to register a bite on the rod tip. Similar none advantage if the fish go right or left. So, 75% of the time. There is less or no advantage in straightening the hook length out. There is no advantage in straightening the hook length out other than in Alex,s mind! If your worried about the fish picking up your hook bait but rejecting the hook bait before you get a proper bite because the fish swims off and moves the bomb (the bolt rig effet). The answer is to shorten the hook length to as short as 3-4 inches from the bomb. Using a heavier bomb and tightening up on the rod tip can help as well. Think about how a method feeder works.

Have match fishing magazine not shown this on their underwater series? I think the bait will fall away from the bomb if kept on a tight line but not sure!? I also think having a straight hooklength is an advantage to keep the bait away from the bomb that could spook fish but I would never move the bomb to straighten it for fear of pulling the hook into a snag and away from a feature if fishing to 1.

Your correct Nathan, it your using long hook lengths you could create an angle to put the hook bait away from the bomb. However, if your using a typical hook length of 8 inches – 15 inches long in winter on commercials. The angle created by feeling the bomb down to the bottom of the lake will only put the hook bait a few inches away from the bomb at best. So, you might as well use a short hook length. Feeling the bomb down to the bottom in shallow water gives almost no advantage because there is almost no angle. The hook bait will follow the bomb to the bottom and only free fall the length of the hook length. Not enough to make any significant difference in my honest opinion!

Fish backing away from the bomb might be an issue on big fish venues. However, on our typical commercial venues. Location of the fish is the key thing especially in the colder months. Find the fish and you normally get bites with any length of hook length. Getting the fish to give positive bites is then the next key issue as carp in winter tend/often mouth hook baits. That rocking, tap, tap, tap on the tip when using the cone is a good example of whats going on. (Plenty of film on youtube of this) Use a heavy bomb and a short hook length and the bites become much more positive because of the bolt rig effect.

Will Raison got on to this last winter when he started using PVA bags on a method feeder and with a very short hook lengths. Very small but heavy banjo feeders would do a similar job.

On our typical commercial venues. Im unsure if the fish could ever see the bomb on the bottom because of the silt on the bottom. Using a critically ballanced bait or pop-up on a very short hook length goes one step further.

What’s typical where you fish is different to where I do, 3-4ft is normal for me!
Never used PVA and never understood why they use it on e method feeder!?

I,ve fished at least 10 different lakes in matches against you Nathan. None of them where 3ft deep unless you mean in the margins, lol. What I mean by a normal commercial venue is a lake thats stuffed with carp and other fish and has a loan of soft crap on the lake bed.

The method and PVA are not what you would normally use when your fishing shallow and slapping your pole, Nathan. However, the Fin did try it once in a fisho final.

I think Nathan is talking about a 3′ or 4′ hooklength not depth?

Yes mr machine, you’re right!
And i don’t understand your comment about slapping pole in relation to method feeder trueblue??

I was talkng about hook lengths, Bagging Machine. :rolleyes:

That makes no sense and will you answer my question please!?

Nathan, why do you not use PVA?

If you wanted to have a very small amount of feed very close to your hook. Is there a better way than using PVA?

A very short hook length and 1oz bomb will do a similar job to a method feeder and small PVA bag. The PVA bag is held on the flat method feeder by elastic. Will Raison suggested in one of his video,s last winter that by using a method feeder and a small PVA bag. The elastic would cut though the PVA bag quickly allowing the feed to start drawing a fish to the rig. A PVA bag on its own takes several minutes to melt. So, using the method feeder PVA bag speeds up the process of getting the free offerings in to the swim. Those fish Will Raison was catching where not scared of a method feeder. So, unlikely that they would be scared of a bomb!

My main point is that a short hook length will give more positive bites and more hook ups. On the typical commercial venue. The bomb or method feeder does not spook the fish. So, using a long hook length reduces the chances of catching. There are always going to be venues and individual days when the fish do back off a bomb or feeder and a longer hook length will produce more positive bites. However, having the line in a straigth line does not mean that the fish are going to register a bite more quickly. Just as much chance that no bite is registered because of the length of line between the hook and the bomb.

Just seams a lot of fannying about and I do well and feel confident just with a hookbait, no feed in winter.

You still haven’t explained your comment about slapping??