I use the quick stops for threading the bread onto the hair and generally 2 or 3 discs

I haven’t had a problem with the bread coming off to be honest, are you really forcing the cast or is it a gentle lob

Have a look at this weeks Tightlines podcast (4th March) as Steve shows his set up for this on that episode.

I used the bread discs yesterday in a match to good effect. I cut down a pole section saturday night about 8-10mm and used this to make the discs. As it was a spare of the moment thing I didn’t have any Warburton’s Thick slice bread which is best for the job I’ve heard. Instead I just had plain bread.

For my rig I had a 1/3oz-2/3oz guru square lead attached to a korum feedabead. I then tied on a korum quickchange bead using a grinner knot. To this I added a 12″ hooklength of 0.16 Fox Micro Plus XT to a size 14 Guru QM1. I decided to use a korum quickstop to keep the bread discs on and had a hair length of about an inch. To finish the rig off I put 2 no.8 stotz 4″ away from the hook. You can vary the depth that the bread is popped up by moving the stotz or if you want to go higher off the deck than 12″ you will have to put a longer hooklength on obivously.

hi chris i have used this method down at w/a on a couple of matches, i use warbatons toast bread cut the crust off and roll it flat then cut 10mm discs. then i just use a quick stop but i put on 2 or 3 discs at a time.

hope your catching well at milemead, ive just got this sunday at w/a and thats the last winter league match there. then i been down to keep an eye on you at milemead.

Going away from what others have said I use Tesco long life bread as it is doughy! I also microwave it and put it into a freezer bag still warm to make it takier.

Stop wise, Quickstops all the way. Never had a problem with the bread coming off on impact providing the cast is feathered down.

Use a simple bait band as you would with pellet making sure you fully stretch the band before threading the bread on.

If you find the force of impact is forcing the bread off the hook feather the cast or try using a lighter lead.

As dave has said use a pellet band (large one) I’ve never lost bread discs on it. It’s far quicker and easier than faffin about with loops and bait stops, I do the same with boillies and have never found carp to be shy of taking the baits.

personally prefer a helicopter rig these days as the setup lets you change from a lead to a method, cage or rocket feeder without having to have more than one rod. Simples…

This is something we have been doing at Mallory for about 5 winters But it’s still deadly, I’ve made myself a couple of telescopic punches out of pole section 7mm & 12mm and punch the bread on my side tray,some people do it at home. I never bother steaming or rolling the bread quite the opposite I want it on the hair as fluffy as I can because I want the discs to be fishing as soon as it hits the water and if it’s steamed and rolled it will sink to the bottom in an unnatural way.
Also I never put any shot down the line as I believe that it takes on water and sinks slowly to the bottom you want the bread to act as naturally as possible and anchoring it down with a shot a few inches away defeats the object
I like to use a small hook a size 18 or 16 kamasan b981 with a 12mm hair normally holding 2discs with a clear boilie stop.

The only thing I can add to all the good info is if you are cast ing a long way or having trouble with little fish is to try the crushes take a bit about 5cm long and fould them over so the crusts are back to back it just makes it a bit tougher

I don’t understand people going to the hastle of cutting up old pole sections when they probably have a set of meat punches tucked away somewhere. The metal cuts so much better too, in my opinion of course!

@GavinG wrote:

I don’t understand people going to the hastle of cutting up old pole sections when they probably have a set of meat punches tucked away somewhere. The metal cuts so much better too, in my opinion of course!

Couldn’t agree more….pure affectation imho.

Bread actually stays popped up for a lot longer than you think. Having tested it in the margins i actually gave up after two hours one winters day as it obviously wasnt going to sink.
As for punches i had a few old broken pole sections laying about and made myself some nice punches out of them. Personally i havent seen any really good metal punches, most are far too bulky and cumbersome.

So when are we going to see the GURU versions in striking orange?~clap

Chris what you have said is spot on mate and I agree with you on not compacting or steaming the bread. As you say you want it to expand and be as light and fluffy as possibly, hanging suspended off the deck for the carp to slurp in, not be lying close to or on the bottom. I have fished the bread a lot for carp for the past two winters and I share the same thinking with regards to presentation as you. the fish are not on the deck, but a big, visible, easily digestable bait presented at the same water column they are located in is too much to resist.

I also have two questions for Steve if he could kindly answer them for me. Fistly is why is there so many different ways of thinking when regarding lead size when fishing popped bread? I am in the train of thought that you are primarily zigging the bait, with the bait popped from the lead so a larger weight is necessary to maintain a curve in the rods tip to to show drop back indications, something I believe it is not possible to show as effectively on a smaller lead. I also believe the bigger lead helps to prevent the carp ejecting the bait as it pulls the hook into the mouth. Please could you expand on your thinking behind this, not only to help myself but others?
Secondly why do you advocate the use of a long hair? and is this only for certain venues or in all instances of fishing popped bread? From experience this winter I have experienced more lost fish and hook pulls at the net (or when changing direct angle of pressure) using a longer hair, approx 20mm from the shank of a Tubertini 861 with 3-4 bread disks. Shanking the bread disks off the hook on a shorter hair has resulted in a better hook hold and a higher percentage of fish landed, but has resulted in more aborted takes and more wrap round indicatiosn than associated drop back bites. Please could you explain your theories on hair lengths and how to reduce fish loss?

The only reason i use a long hair is to allow for the expansion of the bread once it takes on water. If its too short the hook can be kicked off at a bad angle and aborted takes can result depending on the size of fish you are targetting.
As for lead size i dont personally see you would need a larger lead than usual. My choice of lead is purely dictated by how far i want to cast as opposed to trying to increase the bolt effect. I fish the bread with a very slight bend in the tip and bites are normally signified by a rocking motion of the quiver tip as the hooked fish tries to eject the hook. With long hooklengths i actually believe increased resistance (heavy lead) can be a bad thing as the Carp has plenty of scope to shed the hook. Whereas with a lightish lead there is minimal resistance and by the time a Carp realises something is wrong the hook is already in. The same applies on the bottom at this time of year as in i believe light leads, long hooklengths and runnings rigs are more effective than short bolt style rigs.

@Cutnut wrote:

@GavinG wrote:

I don’t understand people going to the hastle of cutting up old pole sections when they probably have a set of meat punches tucked away somewhere. The metal cuts so much better too, in my opinion of course!

Couldn’t agree more….pure affectation imho.

Let me explain as its obvious you have no idea what im talking about and very quick to assume its for affect!
Theres a couple of reasons why i dont use “meat punches” firstly as Steve has said they are bulky and a full set takes up alot of room in your box.
The main reason is my punches are easier to use!!With a normal punch to be able to use say 2 discs you either have to punch about 10 times so the discs start to appear at the top opening or you punch twice and push them out with a disgorger or the like, a 2 handed operation,on a freezing cold windy day with the rain pissing down thats hassle to me!

Ive telescoped 2 bits of carbon together one end is blanked off and used as a “plunger” to push the cut disc out of the tube, exactly the same principle as a Seymo Lunchpunch or a syringe with the end cut off except on a smaller scale, i can punch however many discs i like and present them directly onto a baiting needle in perfect alignment without actually touching them, no need to worry about wet hands.

Each to their own, what others like is not always right for others!

Personally I always have more than one hooklink on the go so it’s not a hassle for me. The Korum meat punches I use are 10mm from cutting edge to where the bait comes out (less than the thickness of two slices of thick white) so I’m not punching loads! Infact, two punches sit perfectly to allow me to push the quickstop through the cutting side and out the back. A gentle pull on the hooklength then see’s it pop out nicely on the hair without ever touching my fingers.

As for bulkyness, what’s two or three punches in a dirty great box that has 100’s of rigs in, plus all the other paraphinalia? Certainly I’d imagine the handles are much easier to hold with numb hands!

Like I said, each to their own, my way works perfectly well for me.

“Infact, two punches sit perfectly to allow me to push the quickstop through the cutting side and out the back. A gentle pull on the hooklength then see’s it pop out nicely on the hair without ever touching my fingers.”

Sounds spot on that G!

im think of trying this method this weekend..as far as lead choice goes im i correct in thinking a light lead is best as a heavier lead will drop to the bottom faster hence less stress on the bread coming off? does a 10 second slice last longer on the hair? thoughts on a pop up with a small cage feeder with liq bread v the bomb?

Gavin, in no way was i saying there is anything wrong with your way. I just prefer mine as it works for me, as does yours for you. I think Chris is pretty much saying the same. At the end of the day as long as each method works, surely thats what its all about.

@carpmagic wrote:

Gavin, in no way was i saying there is anything wrong with your way. I just prefer mine as it works for me, as does yours for you. I think Chris is pretty much saying the same. At the end of the day as long as each method works, surely thats what its all about.

Likewise, each to their own, theres more than one way to skin a cat!!!

Indeed, as long as the way you use works, thats all that matters! Not that I ever suggested anyone else was wrong!

What I do know is it’s a deadly method and one thats worth putting time into to to find what works where you fish. Or if you’re even more anorak like you can do what I did out the back one cold day with a loaf, loads of hooklengths and loads of buckets of pond water seeing how long they stay popped up for, combo’s of punches and hooks and line to get slow sinkers!

Not in my experience they dont, they just swim off slowly and hook themselves, then all you see is the rocking of the tip as they are shaking their heads trying to throw the hook. I always use the light tips on my quiver rods as i like to see indications.

@GLEBE1 wrote:

@Cutnut wrote:

@GavinG wrote:

I don’t understand people going to the hastle of cutting up old pole sections when they probably have a set of meat punches tucked away somewhere. The metal cuts so much better too, in my opinion of course!

Couldn’t agree more….pure affectation imho.

Let me explain as its obvious you have no idea what im talking about and very quick to assume its for affect!
Theres a couple of reasons why i dont use “meat punches” firstly as Steve has said they are bulky and a full set takes up alot of room in your box.
The main reason is my punches are easier to use!!With a normal punch to be able to use say 2 discs you either have to punch about 10 times so the discs start to appear at the top opening or you punch twice and push them out with a disgorger or the like, a 2 handed operation,on a freezing cold windy day with the rain pissing down thats hassle to me!

Ive telescoped 2 bits of carbon together one end is blanked off and used as a “plunger” to push the cut disc out of the tube, exactly the same principle as a Seymo Lunchpunch or a syringe with the end cut off except on a smaller scale, i can punch however many discs i like and present them directly onto a baiting needle in perfect alignment without actually touching them, no need to worry about wet hands.

Understood perfectly as it only took one simple line to get a full wrap around in March, thanks Chris.~clap

@Cutnut wrote:

@GLEBE1 wrote:

@Cutnut wrote:

@GavinG wrote:

I don’t understand people going to the hastle of cutting up old pole sections when they probably have a set of meat punches tucked away somewhere. The metal cuts so much better too, in my opinion of course!

Couldn’t agree more….pure affectation imho.

Let me explain as its obvious you have no idea what im talking about and very quick to assume its for affect!
Theres a couple of reasons why i dont use “meat punches” firstly as Steve has said they are bulky and a full set takes up alot of room in your box.
The main reason is my punches are easier to use!!With a normal punch to be able to use say 2 discs you either have to punch about 10 times so the discs start to appear at the top opening or you punch twice and push them out with a disgorger or the like, a 2 handed operation,on a freezing cold windy day with the rain pissing down thats hassle to me!

Ive telescoped 2 bits of carbon together one end is blanked off and used as a “plunger” to push the cut disc out of the tube, exactly the same principle as a Seymo Lunchpunch or a syringe with the end cut off except on a smaller scale, i can punch however many discs i like and present them directly onto a baiting needle in perfect alignment without actually touching them, no need to worry about wet hands.

Understood perfectly as it only took one simple line to get a full wrap around in March, thanks Chris.~clap

My pleasure lol!!

Hi Chris,

If it’s lack of confidence with the bread staying on, you could try getting some small marsh mallows and cut them in the size of a 8 or 10mm disc and put this between 2 bread discs. The marsh mallow floats insuring that it’s always popped up.
As Steve said though, you will be surprised at how long the bread stays popped up.
I’ve caught a lot of fish on both methods though.Hope this helps.
cheers
Coops

I use boilie stops without a problem, baitchief.

If your using a running rig. The bread/bomb hitting the water is unlikely to rip off the hair rigged bread punches. The running line will/should go though the swivel to reduce the force on the hook bait as the bomb hits the water. However, fresh disc,s of bread will take a lot of force before being ripped off a hair with a boilie stop. Try pulling 3 bread disc,s off a hair rig with a boilie stop in the house. Thats a lot of force needed to rip even one disc of bread off the hair!

If the disc,s of bread where coming off the hair as the bomb hits the water. You would often see your disc,s of bread on the surface of the water. Even if your fishing at distance. The ducks would soon find those disc,s of bread if they where floating on the surface. In my experience. If ducks see a free meal every time you cast out. The ducks will soon tell you that your bread is being ripped off the hook length by the force of the bait hitting the water. So, trust that the bread is still on the hair after the bomb has hit the deck.

As Steve Ringer says. The bread will stay popped up for several hours and will not fall off the hair if left alone.

The key thing to remember with popped up bread fishing is that your bread needs to be as fresh as possible. 5 rounds of bread is enough for a match if used correctly. I cut the 5 slices of bread in to quarters and keep them in a closed plastic bag until i need to change the piece of bread i,ve been using. I change the piece of bread after every 15-20 minutes to make sure the bread im using is as fresh as possible. I keep the piece of bread im using in a closed bait box until i need to replace the hook bait on the hair.

Any punch will work as long as it cuts the disc of bread out cleanly without compressing the bread.

As for the size of bomb. There are 2 ways of fishing popped up bread with a bomb. You can use a feeder but its a summer method so i will leave the feeder approach alone for now. However, its the most devastating method i use on a few venues i fish in summer where bread is allowed!

Steve Ringer explained how to use a small bomb set up perfectly. So, no need for me to add anything to what he had already said.

However, you can also use a heavy bomb with devastating results that would shock many anglers. A 1 1/2 oz bomb is ideal but it can be done correctly with a 1oz bomb on some lakes depending on how soft the lake bottom is. Cast out and carefully tighten up to the bomb until it is almost ready to move. It wants to just about hold under the pressure from the bent rod. Wait a few minutes. Then tighten up a little more to create a critical balance between the rod and the bomb on a very tight line! The rod will be bent right around in a big ark. Does look quite strange but its critical to the set up. Your creating a critically balanced rig that results in almost impossible to miss bites. In fact, ever bite is hooked up and because of the heavy bomb. The fish will bolt unlike with the light bomb set up. Its a lot like fishing the bow on fast flowing rivers and with very similar reults. When you get a bite. You will get a massive and unmissable drop back bite! Amazing how this rig works and has shown me that some of my supposed line bites are in fact real bites that never resulted in a positive enough bite on the light bomb set up.

The heavy bomb rig/set up was developed on Cudmore and i first came across it about 10/12 years ago. It resulted in many massive weights of carp in the most difficult of winter conditions when nothing else would work but popped up bread. Fish a light bomb set up and it resulted in very few proper bites or t seemed. Popped up bread seemed to be forgotten for a while on many waters. Then, it gained popularity again with only the light bomb set up being talked about over the last few years. I take no credit for the rig/set up and the way it was developed. However, its an incredible method and set up that seems to have been forgotten. Try it. You might get a shock at the results!

May be worth looking in the carp section of your local shop and see if the have any rig foam the same colour as the meat and using a piece of meat along side it? Unless the venue lets you use artificial bait’s in matches as you can get imitation meat.

As for the feeding, can’t say I’ve ever done it, but carp anglers do spod over the top of zig-rigs and catch. Perhaps something worth looking at when the water is a bit warmer and the weather won’t allow the use of the pellet wag?

What about boilies? I think Dynamite now do some 10mm pop-ups, else you could cut down larger ones (meaning you can also try different shapes?)

@baitchef wrote:

I think a pop up boily might be a way to go to be honest. I don’t know if it’s just me but I always get the impression that we as match anglers are a bit reluctant to use them for some reason.

Anyway, this might sound a bit daft, but a question for the experts out there. Is it possible do you think to search through the water column if the pop up was botany enough? What I mean is would it be ppossible to tighten up to the lead and then pay out a line at intervals, allowing the pop up to rise in the water?
Or is that a load of nonsense?

I’ve always thought about doing that but never done it. I’d be interested in doing that as well

You can pop up whole or sections of lobworm by injecting them with air using a syringe. Be very careful when using syringes and for goodness sake do not stick the needle into yourself! ~hand Lobworms are pretty resistant to small fish and are about as natural as natural a bait as it comes. I once landed 3 pike between 12lb and 18lb on popped up lobbies on one of the London reservoirs in an afternoon!

Obviously unless you have a frozen supply this will not work until late summer but wasp nest cake is very bouyant and carp love the stuff nearly as much as chub!

@baitchef wrote:

Anyway, this might sound a bit daft, but a question for the experts out there. Is it possible do you think to search through the water column if the pop up was botany enough? What I mean is would it be ppossible to tighten up to the lead and then pay out a line at intervals, allowing the pop up to rise in the water?
Or is that a load of nonsense?

Not sure about that, firstly you would have to use a seriously bouyant bait also i think any slack line you payed out would be taken up by the tow of the lake.

Personally i dont like to pop baits up further than a couple of foot as im of the opinion that the further from the lead the bait is theres less chance of an indication,weve all seen the underwater footage of carp mouthing baits!

If i wanted to search the water column and conditions allowed id reach for the waggler as you can gauge any activity far easier.

A perfect example of this is Sundays match at Mallory, i was on Lake 6 and it was clearer than usual with a cold north easterly blowing so i decided to fish a small feeder a rodlength off the far bank down the slope into the deeper water rather than the normal up the shelf clipping the grass.

After an hour there had been one foulhooked carp caught, going into the second hour my swim livened up and i had a few liners and caught 4 carp in quick succession, then as if someone had flicked a switch they vanished!

Normally when this happens the anglers either side of you start to get indications as the shoal moves around but they didnt so there was only one way the fish went……..up!!

I got my waggler rod out of its sleeve and set the float at 3 foot with 2 reds on the hook, first chuck i had a pound skimmer, then lost 2 carp , the last one leaving a scale the size of a 50p so i shallowed up till i was eventualy fishing 18 inches deep in approx 4 feet of water, i ended up with 24 carp for 86lb and the lake win, i dont reckon id have seen half of those bites if id have popped up a bait 18 inches from the surface.

I last september went to daventry on the wall with a couple of carp mates and with previous catches on zig rigged 10 mm pop up I went with my faith pinned on the baggin waggler and a load of bait with the match being catching from the top down or bottom up. It soon became apparant that the carp didnt want the float over their heads the carp lads stuffed me, and I had to admit defeat on the day.I have previously fished the tuesday opens and to a degree understand the up in the water style 10 mm white boilies were being intercepted as soon as the bomb hit the deck and lifting to its set depth 2 ft under surface

baitchef wrote:

Anyway, this might sound a bit daft, but a question for the experts out there. Is it possible do you think to search through the water column if the pop up was botany enough? What I mean is would it be possible to tighten up to the lead and then pay out a line at intervals, allowing the pop up to rise in the water? Or is that a load of nonsense?

It really is your lucky day, Baitchef. I had an article published on the very subject in the Angling Star about 5 years ago after destroying a number of venues on the very subject your asking about.

You can search though the water column with popped up bread if you get the balance right with your tackle and the buoyancy in the bread or you can add extra buoyancy to the rig to help the pop up rise up in the water as and when you wish.

This is my way and in my opinion is the most superior method to do what your asking. You need to use a running rig, an Enterprise tackle adjuster stop, 4lb maxima main line and a 2cm+ cube of crust from an un-cut loaf.(a carp of 1lb will have no problems in eating a cube of bread of this size). I use the sides and bottom of a tin loaf from ASDA.(i cut the cubes up in the house and keep then in an air tight container). There is more than enough buoyancy in the cube of bread to pull the line though the swivel as you give the rig extra line. This means you can work the bread though the water layers from a few inches off the deck (depending on the length of hook length) and up to the surface without a problem by just giving out line once the bomb/feeder has landed on the deck and you have sank the line. The biggest issue with this method is seeing bites on the quiver tip. The very simple answer to the problem of seeing bites is to use a swing tip. The lack of resistance with the swing tip results in beautiful bream like lifts of the swing tip or positive drop-back bites. None of those little jiggles on the tip that Carpmagic described as the carp attempt to unhook themselves. You see every little nibble with the swing tip and very few rejected takes! The Drennan Tench rod takes some beating for this method!

A second way of doing what your asking about is to add the body of a float(crystal waggler body) or similar buoyant aid to the line next to the ledger stop. That gives you the added buoyancy needed to allow the main line to be pulled though the swivel very easily and pop up a bait at any depth with ease by just giving line. So, its very easy to work a pop up bait though the water column. This pop up rig is not critically balanced to the popped up bread like in the first set up. However, it does work. The advantages with this set up are that you can pop up any size of bread or any other type of pop-up bait for that matter and fish it at any depth though out the water column by just giving line. You can also use stronger/heavier main line with this set up because of the added buoyancy from the float body or similar buoyancy aid. However, this is not a critically balanced set up like the first set up. So seeing and being able to read bites is still a big issue. Its jiggle jiggle on the quiver tip unless the fish are feeding very confidently and i believe you dont see all the bites that a swing tip shows.

There are issues in getting the balance right with the swing tip when adding a buoyancy aid. However, adding weight to the swing tip can solve this issue and give much better bite indication than with the quiver tip!

If you want to feed and i do in summer. Rough liquidized bread in a cage feeder is the way to go!

Others have used floating expander pellets or other floating baits in ground bait to feed the swim(issues of floating baits being fed and so banned on many venues). The Drennan cage feeders with the stiff plastic arms are by fare the best for this method as they reduce tangles and give free running of the line though the swivel!

If you want to pop up meat. Get yourself a boilie punch and foam!

Dog biscuits are easy to pop up and suggar puffs can be deadly on the right venues!

Steve

If I’ve read your post correctly, I’d be very sceptical that a piece of crust which will absorb water, will have sufficient buoyancy to offset the tow and resistance against the line and enable the crust to lift through the water column when line is released. You could pay out line all day but all you will do is increase size of the bow in the line and reduce the resistance against the quiver tip.

The simplest way is to use either the enterprise adjuster which allows you to change the length of the hook length or to use a preston quick change hook length adaptor and different length of hook lengths.

Because you are not feeding once you find the depth the fish are feeding at it is a simple case of making small adjustments to keep in touch with them.

Adding a buoyancy aid such as a crystal float body over complicates matters and will increase the resistance in the rig in addition to icreasing the likely hood of false bites in the way of liners.

IMO it’s far better to keep it simple and search through the water column by changing the length of your hook length as this in the long term will help anglers understand what is happening under the water

dave brittian wrote;

If I’ve read your post correctly, I’d be very sceptical that a piece of crust which will absorb water, will have sufficient buoyancy to offset the tow and resistance against the line and enable the crust to lift through the water column when line is released. You could pay out line all day but all you will do is increase size of the bow in the line and reduce the resistance against the quiver tip.

Sorry Dave but on this occasion you are wrong. A 2cm cube of crust from an un-cut loaf has sufficient buoyancy to offset the tow and resistance against 4lb Maxima line. I can literally run the crust up to the surface and see the bread floating on the water. I can also fish the bread 1 inch under the surface of the water or at any depth in seconds without the need to change the length of the hook length. Try doing that with a basic zig-rig. However, the main benefit of the set up is that the bait can be worked in a very natural manner. However, its amazing how often a carp will nail the bait as it rises though the water.

dave brittian wrote:

Because you are not feeding once you find the depth the fish are feeding at it is a simple case of making small adjustments to keep in touch with them.

Dave, as i said in my last post. If you want to feed and i do in summer. Rough liquidized bread in a cage feeder is the way to go! Popped up bread is not just a cold water, winter method!

dave brittian wrote:

Adding a buoyancy aid such as a crystal float body over complicates matters and will increase the resistance in the rig in addition to icreasing the likely hood of false bites in the way of liners.

I agree, Dave! That set up with the buoyancy aid was the starting point to how my method was developed. Other anglers who attempted to follow what i was doing. Never got any further than the buoyancy aid. Working out that a 2cm cube of crust has sufficient buoyancy to offset the tow and resistance against 4lb Maxima line gives something completely different to a basic zig-rig. The use of a swing tip was the final piece in the jigsaw with this method.

dave brittian wrote:

IMO it’s far better to keep it simple and search through the water column by changing the length of your hook length as this in the long term will help anglers understand what is happening under the water.

Dave, i dont disagree with the idea of keeping things simple. However, sometimes simple is not enough/best. New methods and different ways of doing things are invented that dominate the original, simple idea.

I have actually seen this in full flow as described and it does actually work! The bread can be raised to the surface and down again and then back upto the surface!

As TB states this is a method that has been practised and developed over a decade or more at Cudmore so I would concur that what TB states is what happens.

Steve as you know if I post something I will always validate my explanation.

Quite a long time ago I did some experimenting with bread both on rivers and on lakes to try and understand the effect of the flow, (rivers), and on still waters why popped up bread could be deadly in winter for big carp when fished in conjunction with liquidised bread in a feeder, (this is pre commercials.

Despite what many thought even when with a size 6 or 8 hook the bread would have sufficient buoyancy to float when presented on a still water,(I did several experiments in a water butt first to validate this).

The flow on my local river had sufficient force to push the bread down however it did waver in the current just off bottom quite enticingly with neutral buoyancy which is why I believe it is so devastating for chub.

Going back to the experiments I tried to imitate what you have reflected in your post although I was using 6lb maxima and could not get the bait to rise to the top by paying out line, however if I struck the hook off the bread would float to the top.

If I reverse engineered it and set my hook length over depth, (you have tond leave the bail arm open until you see the bait on the top) I could get the bread to float and then tighten up and lower the bait through the water, however because of the bend in the tip fishing 35 yds out I came to the conclusion that the tow in addition to the absorbsion of water would drag the bait down to where my stop was set.

I hadn’t given it anymore thought until I read your post which is why I stated I’d be very sceptical.

Because you so kind to respond I’ve been out in the garden experimenting in the water but and here are my findings:

To put a decent bend in a carbon tip equivelent to the tow experienced on a lake it requires 3 SSG, (a 1 inch deflection).

If you cut a 2 cm crust from a thick loaf using a mini grip stop to stop it and no hook you the buoyancy of the crust is sufficient to pull 4lb line through the lead and lift the bait to the surface, (this is with the bait carefully dropped into the tank, (if it hits with the impact of casting it will absorb more water).

If the crust is lifted up and down a few times once it has been in the water for a minute it’s buoyancy reduces.

Doing the same experiment with a single SSG on and the crust still has enough buoyancy to pull the line through the swivel, however if you give the line a couple of pulls the shot will overcome the original buoyancy effectivel sinking the crust until the shot sits on the bottom, (the crust still floats above the shot but with reduced buoyancy.

If you add 2SSG and lower the crust and lead into the water the crust sinks instantly.

Given the above experiments and the fact that the tow in most venues will be equal to or greater than the 2 SSG required to sink the crust, I still remain sceptical ~think

If you also add the impact of the bait with the water, more depth, a hook and a proper lead stop and buoyancy will be further reduced.

Im not fussed about being wealthy but i really wish i had enough money to buy a place with a swimming pool, i’d spend so many hours in there with my snorkel on experimenting with stuff like this!!!!

i think korda sinkers(like a float stop but with tungsten in them) on a 3 ft hooklenth can fish a pop up at any depth from 3ft off to 3 inch off

or good old 3x no 8 stotz

both will slide up and down the line no probs??

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Korda-Sinkers-All-Sizes-and-Colours-/320658486546?pt=UK_SportingGoods_FishingAcces_RL&var=&hash=item76bff622e4

Dave, there are big difference between different types of bread. You will never get the same effect with the crust from a Warburtons sliced loaf.

Next time your planning on going fishing. Go to ASDA and get a white tin loaf.

http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/asda-compare-prices/Bread/ASDA_Whole_White_Tin_Loaf_800g.html.

Carefully cut the loaf in half so you have separated the top from the bottom of the loaf. You want the crust from the bottom half of the loaf. The top half of the loaf and the other waist is fine for making rough liquidized bread.

As i said in earlier posts. This is mainly my summer popped up bread method and i use plenty of liquidized bread fed though a cage feeder. However, the rig is still very effective in the colder months fished with a bomb.

Get a 20p piece(2cm) and carefully cut the crust to that thickness from the bottom half of the loaf. You should end up with 3 long strips of crust. 2 small end pieces and the fluffy white inside of the loaf. I also cut the edges off the strips of crust for the liquidizer along with that fluffy inside.

Now cut the strips into cubes 2cm in size. Best to cut the strips, crust side down to not push any air out of the fluffy white bread. Put the 2cm square cubes of crust in an air tight container and go fishing.

Set up a running bomb rig with 4lb Maxima line. Hair rig a cube of crust and cast out. Keep an eye on where the rig lands. Sink the line on a tight line to the bomb. Take your bail arm off and give out free line from the reel. You will see the free line moving in to the lake. The cube of bread will pop up on the surface of the water every time!

Once you see the bread on the surface. Engage your bail arm and take in the slack line while keeping an eye on the bread. You will see the bread sink under the surface as you take line. I like to draw the rod back in an ark to make the bread sink very slowly. Once the ledger stop reaches the bomb. You will feel the weight of the bomb. Simple push the rod forward in an ark and the bread will start to rise though the water at the speed you dictate by the movement of the rod.

Depending on the depth of the venue. You might need to play around with back winding or pulling line off the reel to give line. Eventually, the bread will pop up on the surface again! You can do this time and time again until the bread is taken by a carp.

If you want to fish the bread at a static depth. Just put the rod on a rod rest. You will soon work out at what depth the bread is being fished at by the amount of line you have given once you have tightened up to the bomb or from the amount of line you have drawn in once the bread has been pulled under the surface.

Try it with a well balanced swing tip. You get much more control of the bread and you will see many more bites than with a quiver tip.

what a cracking thread lads I am off tomorrow bread at the ready.

TrueBlue do you do coaching lessons ??

I read nearly every post you do or reply to, and they are always top notch. You sure know your onions. They are so precise and to the point!! Alot of which you write goes over my head, I’m sure like others on this site.

Do you fish for a big team? From what I read I think you should be or are already.

Do you write for a paper or magazine?? You could do the pop up bread article (If your not sponsored maybe ASADA would be intrested) only joking!!! Seriously a critically balanced pellet article ect ect.

Do you use your real name on this site!! I look out for your name every week in the Angling Times, Mail ect and I dont see you!! maybe your drawing is like mine lately!! Gone tits up lol.. TrueBlue I’m confused is it Birmingham or Everton you support.. love the posts for me need to be condensed a bit!! its like reading Lord of the rings sometimes lol.. Keep it up your number one fan…

Dishyfish, thanks! No, i,ve never done any coaching apart from attempting to help a few of my match angling mates.

No, i,ve never fished for a big team. I,ve only fished for small teams but i have a North West winter league team winners medal and a National section winners medal in my previous life before commercial venues where invented. I was sponsored by Team Browning Cudmore a few years ago. Then they realised that im a Scouser!

I,ve done a few articles for angling mags and the weekly angling press over the years. As i said in one of my other posts in this thread. I did an article on popped up bread for the Angling Star about 5 years ago. If im ever asked to do another article. Im sure i would be happy to do it. Just need to be asked again!

Yes, thats my real name in my profile and im an Everton supporter!

Your not looking hard enough in the match results if your looking for my name. I always draw well or so im told.

Angling Mail match report for North West. Weekend 26/27 Feb – Stapeley Cudmore, Whitmore, Newcastle-Under-Lyme, Staffordshire, Sun, New Pools 1 and 5, 33. Steve Gerrard (Stapeley Cudmore) 50-12-0, carp to 6 lb plus silvers, poled maggot, peg 151, Pool 5; Mark Kearns (Stapeley Cudmore) 22-12-0; Ian Sinker (Stapeley Cudmore) 19-3-0; Pete Holmes (Pickering’s of Burslem) 18-0-0; J. Lindsy (Stapeley Cudmore) 17-4-0; Melvyn Kearns (Stapeley Cudmore) 15-10-0.

Why do the angling mail always give the wrong info in match reports? I dont do maggots unless they are dead and the hook bait for the method. Maggots and catching silvers are for girls, lol

I dont fish as many open matches these days as i use to. I dont stay on one venue for very long. Much happier doing hit an runs with the pools money on different match venues. Keeps match fishing interesting and in profit!

Your not the first to say that my posts could be condensed a bit. However, in my opinion if somethings worth writing about. Then i might as well give some detail and hopefully someone might learn something or at least come up with a few new ideas that might help.

Get in the queue if you want to be my number 1 fan, lol

@GLEBE1 wrote:

This is something we have been doing at Mallory for about 5 winters But it’s still deadly, I’ve made myself a couple of telescopic punches out of pole section 7mm & 12mm and punch the bread on my side tray,some people do it at home. I never bother steaming or rolling the bread quite the opposite I want it on the hair as fluffy as I can because I want the discs to be fishing as soon as it hits the water and if it’s steamed and rolled it will sink to the bottom in an unnatural way.
Also I never put any shot down the line as I believe that it takes on water and sinks slowly to the bottom you want the bread to act as naturally as possible and anchoring it down with a shot a few inches away defeats the object
I like to use a small hook a size 18 or 16 kamasan b981 with a 12mm hair normally holding 2discs with a clear boilie stop.

CHECK OUT THE CARP SUPER-SLINGA ON EBAY. THIS CAN BE USED ZIG-RIGGED AND HELPS WITH BOUYANCY, HOOK PRESENTATION & BAIT RETENTION