Yes it is

I believe from a message Abi posted elsewhere, they were just finalising a few things

What get me with the county champs is the number of people in the top 20 who fish in the super cup – supposedly for club anglers only!

I think if your going for a top 20 place in the county champs you should not be allowed to fish in the super cup as you are clearly a better standard than a club angler, who the competition is aimed at.

The County Champs is open to all match anglers who fish opens. Its not a club competition, Gamegreen.

County champs is open to all anglers, Being a Club angler means you fish for a club it doesent mean you dont fish opens and that you not good enough to fish and win 100 peg matches. I know at least 5 top Dorking anglers who fish for a club?? Does this mean they cant fish the county champs?? (i dont think so). All this means is they have joint a club for certain parts of the year when open matches are less attended compared to Club Matches. 😎 😎

From what i understand county champs will definitely go ahead again. If it didnt though we as match anglers would only have ourselves to blame as even with it being free to enter anglers still did nothing but moan about it.

If they got it right in the first place then im sure there would be less moaning and would be supported by a lot more anglers. 1st thing that needs to be changed is to only allow one points scoring result per weekend for each angler. At the moment those who fish opens regularly on both Sat and Sun have a massive advantage. 2nd, the final needs to be on different venues but i do except that the final still needs to be in or close to the middlands for travelling reasons. Most anglers qualify on comercial carp venues with small pools and canal type lakes. Seems strange to then use a totally different type of venue than what most anglers are use too and have qualified on in the 1st place. Using the same venue for the final gives a feeling of giving some teams a bigger advantage over other teams. Moving the final around a little and on to different types of pools and lakes would at least make it feel a little fairer in some years even if its not totally fair and some teams will always have some kind of advantage.

Trueblue, your post is exactly what im on about. Why not just praise somebody for actually running something for match anglers rather than ripping into it?
Also trying to go through all the results looking for an anglers best result over the weekend is unworkable, it would take forever! Surely the more simple an event is the more likely it is to work!

Very simple to count only one points scoring result (the higher points score) each weekend, Carpmajic. Every result is in-putted anyway and added to each anglers running total. If anglers have two points scoring results on the same weekend. The higher points scoring result counts. If as i guess its done on a simple data base. The data base would do the job for you. You only need to ask the data base to count the higher points score each wekend for each angler. Your still only in-putting the same results. The data base does all the work after that and gives the running total for each angler and creates each league! Very easy and simple but fairer to everybody!

Why would you not want a fairer competition that is open to more match anglers?

Why would you be against the final being on different venues and in particular on types of venues that most anglers qualify on?

My point is to make the competition could be better and fairer to all. Without these simple changes. Is it going to improve and become bigger and or contnue and/or stop the moaning?

what i am trying to say is rather than pulling the comp to pieces why dont you point out how good it is? From what you have posted there isnt a thing right with it!
As for your other comments i really dont care where the final is, its a free competition to enter so i will go where the organisers decide to stage it. And as for a fairer competition your having a laugh, your system is no fairer than the current one. Some get two shots at scoring points, others one, hows that fair?
The county champs is also open to all, every single angler who fishes an open match unless i am missing something. Granted you have to register but is that really too much to ask!
I personally think the format is good, but if match anglers keep slating it then we wont have a county champs. Why would a company run an event that gets negative PR. Then when its gone you’ll be moaning about its demise. Match anglers in general need to wake up and smell the coffee before its too late and there is nothing left to fish.

Im not sure there is much right with the competition at the moment from a personal point of view, carpmagic. I dont match fish on both days of the weekend very often. So im not likely to qualify for my county final. So, i have very little interest and dont pick up the Angling Times to check the league i would be in if i entered! Would love to be able to point out how great it is but until its as fair and equal as possible. Then im not likely to be prasing the competition especially when it could be so much better.

No, its never going to be totally fair to all when some anglers are getting two chances to gain points each weekend when compared with those who can only fish one match each weekend. Nothing can be done to fix that issue. Thats life!

However, its much fairer to award one lot of points for each weekend, dont you think? If you dont think its fairer. Please explain because i dont understand your logic unless it suit you personally.

I,ve already shown how easy it is to make the changes in the rules to make the competition fairer and so in my opinion better. Make the changes and i will back the competition. Might even compete against you in the final. 🙂

A fairer competition would give more interest from more anglers including myself. It would equal more sales of Angling Times from anglers checking results (The competition is a sales pitch afterall, Nothing wrong with a sales pitch if it gives something back). Everybody gains except for those that dont get the added advantage of being lucky enough to be able to match fish on both days of each weekend and potentially getting two lots of points each week!

Personally i cant fault AT on the CC comp, just take the regional correspondants,it cant be easy with all those results coming in every sat/sun evening,especially when you have to give the top 8 anglers,which county,which sponsor/team,weight,& tactics used by the top 2/3,i know because i phone all results in for the watermeadows fishery on the east coast.I aint got a problem with 2 results counting at w/ends myself,thats just how it is,my only slight gripe is “false” numbers fishing to gain extra points,but there is no way AT can police that & in no way can they be to blame,I do find it slightly strange that you criticise the CC trueblue yet it appears from your post above you do not enter it,look at the results or even buy the AT.If AT pulled out of the CC that would be another nail in the coffin of match fishing,granted they now get more results sent in as fisheries/anglers want the points,but apart from that i cant really see what significant benefit AT get from the CC,after all it’s free to enter!.

@Gamagreen wrote:

What get me with the county champs is the number of people in the top 20 who fish in the super cup – supposedly for club anglers only!

I think if your going for a top 20 place in the county champs you should not be allowed to fish in the super cup as you are clearly a better standard than a club angler, who the competition is aimed at.

Sorry if people have misinterpreted what i wrote, it is the supercup that I said is for club angers and i am not having a go at the county champs which is a fantastic competition.

What i am saying is, as a club angler is when you turn up and you are fishing against some of the best anglers in the country in a comp designed for club anglers it makes a mockery of the competition. You might as well open it to the likes of dorking etc. I think it is quite sad that some really top quality anglers who fish open matches most weeks and compete at this higher level think it is ok to drop down when it suites for what some must class as easy pickings.
I know some really good anglers who are members of clubs and fish the odd match but they do this for the craik and would not lower themselves to compete on the club angler circuit.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I am not having a go at either competition i follow them both in the Times each week. It is the individuals who REGULARLY finish in the top 20 or REGULARLY score 20 Kamasan points who still think they should be classed as club angler that gets me. The key word being regularly. I know someone can have a good year and get high points, but when people finish in the top 20 CONSISTANTLY (county champs) and score 20 kamasan points, then they are not club anglers.

Trueblue, you are arguing for arguments sake. It’s a free competition, if you don’t like it don’t go in it. I’d also wager plenty who qualify mostly fish once at weekends, Carpmagic included in that.

Gamagreen, there are plenty of club anglers who fish both club and open matches and vice-versa. These days there is little difference and I include myself in that.

Steve, I know there are plenty who fish both, but as i have stated it is the anglers who reugularly finish top 20 or who consistantly get 20 Kamasan points I am talking about (I think I am right in saying only about 100/120 anglers in the country get 20 points). It beggars belief that these people can even consider themselves club anglers.
If you study the leagues, anglers where the match circuit is not that big can qualify with a low points score and these prossibly could be club anglers. However, I would argue that anglers in regions with a higher number of anglers taking part – like your own Cheshire division, need a much higher score only really obtainable if you are competing in opens on a week in week out basis.

Oh, its free. Must be great then, Steve. If they make the changes that i believe are needed then it would be great for all or at least better than it is at the moment. I would even enter and check the results in the Angling Times!.

Im sure you remember the leagues on Cudmore, SteveMay. You and Andy where in them if i remember correctly. They where made as fair as possible by the fishery team. They only allowed one points scoring result each weekend to keep it interesting. It was set up that way to give all anglers a reasonable chance of competing for a large part of the season. Its at least part of the reason why many of us kept coming back to fish those big opens on that fishery! Whats the difference between the two competitions? Not a lot in my honest opinon except that you can gain double points by fishing open matches and scoring on both weekend matches with the County Champs. I was doing 130 miles round trip every week to fish those opens and compete in that league. Shows that the concept works. Just needs the County Champs competition playing with to make if fairer than it is at the moment!

Gamagreen, the County Champs is an open competition and anybody can enter. Its not open to club anglers unless they fish open matches. Club matches dont count. That means that if someone fishes open matches and is in a club. Those same club anglers are really open match anglers for this competition! Open match anglers are the only anglers whom are able to gain Kammy points because they only get points from open matches. Any angler can be in a club. Does not matter how many Kammy points anglers gain. They are just open match anglers and so able to fish in the County Champs!

Definitely not gone to the wall as far as i know, cant see it starting this year though, would make sense now to start in Jan.

True blue, i am not saying club anglers should not fish the county champs. I’m saying open anglers who CONSISTANTLY gain 20 points in the kamasan league or finish top 20 in the county champs should not compete in the super cup. supposidly a club anglers comp.

What is the defination of a club angler? Just because you are in a club does not make you a club angler. Would Phil Taylor play in his local british legions darts championship just because he is a member? may be a bit of an extreme but you know where i am coming from. Guess its a question of morals, some people just haven’t got any.

@Gamagreen wrote:

True blue, i am not saying club anglers should not fish the county champs. I’m saying open anglers who CONSISTANTLY gain 20 points in the kamasan league or finish top 20 in the county champs should not compete in the super cup. supposidly a club anglers comp

What about the garbolino club angler of the year competition, should sponsored anglers be allowed to fish that?

kid a, same thing happens in the clubman. i dont want to name individual anglers but there are certainly a few anglers who have a healthy reputation on the open circuit.

maybe if you get in the top 20 twice or if you have scored 20 kamasan points in the past say 3 years you should not be eligable for club angler aimed competitions.

Thank you Abi and the AT for running an funding the CC
I can imagine it’s not the easiest of tasks because of the amount of anglers that are allowed to enter
It has ran really well for the first two years. How can people pull it apart because they feel it should be run better for them? It works for the angler that have taken part so far

It’s FREE to enter, it is sponsored and fund by the AT unlike the two large payout competitions that are funded by the ANGLERS and “sponsored” by a tackle maunfacturer, a newspaper and a TV company

Thanks again Abi and the AT

@Gamagreen wrote:

kid a, same thing happens in the clubman. i dont want to name individual anglers but there are certainly a few anglers who have a healthy reputation on the open circuit.

maybe if you get in the top 20 twice or if you have scored 20 kamasan points in the past say 3 years you should not be eligable for club angler aimed competitions.

There are some clearly sponsored anglers in the club angler comp…. I dont want to name names but one I am thinking of doesnt even hide his sponsorship….

Gamagreen and kid_a,. the rules for both club competitions state that sponsored anglers are not allowed to fish in them. If you believe that an angler is sponsored and attempting to fish in one of these competitions. Complain to the organisers and let them deal with it.

The problem your always going to get is that there are very few truely sponsored anglers. Lots of club and open match anglers claim to be sponsored when there results are published in the angling press. In reality most might get a little discount from a local tackle shop that they shop in every week or they are part of a team which has been sponsored by a tackle company. At best most gain some free luggage and a bit of free clothing if there very lucky. Very few gain more than that. So, are they really sponsored? There are also a few anglers who dont have any form of sponsorship but are capable of competing at the very highest levels in our sport. Should they be banned?

@TrueBlue wrote:

Gamagreen and kid_a,. the rules for both club competitions state that sponsored anglers are not allowed to fish in them. If you believe that an angler is sponsored and attempting to fish in one of these competitions. Complain to the organisers and let them deal with it.

The problem your always going to get is that there are very few truely sponsored anglers. Lots of club and open match anglers claim to be sponsored when there results are published in the angling press. In reality most might get a little discount from a local tackle shop that they shop in every week or they are part of a team which has been sponsored by a tackle company. At best most gain some free luggage and a bit of free clothing if there very lucky. Very few gain more than that. So, are they really sponsored? There are also a few anglers who dont have any form of sponsorship but are capable of competing at the very highest levels in our sport. Should they be banned?

The organisers knew the person involved and its pretty clear they are sponsored….

kid-a has made a great point regarding the garbolino club angler, the competition is a JOKE.

True blue, if you are who i think you are i spoke to you at Whiteacres a few years ago – you were sharing a van with Niel Machin. I would say by what i saw that day that you were a very compitent angler.

Would you consider yourself a club angler? would you fish in the super cup or clubman competitions? If you did fish these competitions, won and had your picture plastered all over the AT i am sure you would get some stick on your local match scene.

Maybe the criteria should be how successful you have been in the open matches you have entered ie points scored or maybe to stop any confusion you can only enter one, either the county champs or the super cup.

Anyway i am finished with this topic, its just sad some people will knowingly fish matches designed for club angler when they are seasoned open anglers – imho its the same as cheating.

the only beef i got with the format is that the division/county winners get to fish a big money final, which in turn does give the lads who are able to fish both days a distinct advantage.

Entering hundreds of anglers points each week for the CC must be a mega labour intensive excecise and then having to go through individuals who have more than one set of points during a weekend and then seeing which is the highest score would be a nightmare.

Don’t get me wrong I would like to see only one points score count as I only fish on Sundays, but in reality I appreciate that is most likely a step to far.

I managed to get in the top 10 in my division by only fishing on Sundays and was very pleased with it.
TB give the comp a go as you can get in the semi’s by fishing once a week.
I ended up a bit dismayed that my semi date got changed and I couldn’t fish it, but the comp is great and long may it run.

I think its a good earner for AT as they get lots of advertising revenue from it, but I don’t think there is much wrong with the actual format of it.

The final held at Packington and Barston is an excellet idea too as its smack bang in the centre of the country and both are good venues and teams need to be adaptable to do well.
You may prefer the final to be at Cudmore TB but Barston and Packington are as good a venues as any really.

As for the club comps and Garbolino comp maybe the angler who was taking the piss was me or maybe not I don’t know. From my point of view there are many good anglers who fish these events who are not sponsored and you can see some not so talented anglers get the hump when they see them enter the room (am not talking about me by the way). I have heard anglers talking and saying he shouldn’t be fishing this and neither should he, but they are moaning about non sponsored anglers who just happen to be good and do well on the open match scene.
Apart from the Whiteacres Gaymers festival none of these club angler comps state that if you have framed or won an open match you are not able to qualify for the event.

I have fished the Garbolino club event since the start and no one has ever said anything about not being eligable. I fished the qualifier this year and got in the final, which I fished and did no good in. I am now sponsored and will no longer enter the Garbolino club angler comp and don’t enter the Supercup anymore, but to be honest I have never seen anything in the rules stating anything about sponsorship in the Garbolino comp!

You are always going to get good anglers fishing club comps as they are also members of a club as well as fish and do well in opens.
The winner of the 2011 Garbolino comp is an awesome angler and has won some big events plus there was a fisho finalist from this year fishing the Garbo final to, but they are not sponsored and have every right to fish.
I think some anglers should rise to the challenge rather than moan about good anglers fishing these matches.
I remember fishing the Match angling plus comp years ago and seeing legends like Ken Giles fishing and I loved it and took it as a challenge.
Same when I fished the Woodlands View winter league years ago. I saw anglers fishing that who had fished for Starlets and England and while some moaned I saw it as a challenge to rise to.

Just my thoughts.

Gamagreen said – True blue, if you are who i think you are i spoke to you at Whiteacres a few years ago – you were sharing a van with Niel Machin. I would say by what i saw that day that you were a very compitent angler.

Would you consider yourself a club angler? would you fish in the super cup or clubman competitions? If you did fish these competitions, won and had your picture plastered all over the AT i am sure you would get some stick on your local match scene.

Yes, i am the same angler that you spoke to at White Acres about 5 years ago.

I,ve always considered myself to be a match angler since i was about 20. Before that i fished in what i would call a real club, then a club/team and the odd small open. We fished for trouphies and medals in my first club. The pools where only enough to get me a bag of chips and pay my bus fare home from town if i was lucky enough to win. Things have changed so much today!

In my late teens, i joined a different type of club that also entered lots of team events and the odd big open match. I won the Bridgewater championship when i was 17. In those days we fished against the best teams in the country and the very best open anglers in our sport as a club/team. I was also picked up by a small but very strong local match team for some events. That sort of made me a club/team angler who also fished the odd open. However, in those days there was a different type of cross over between open match anglers and club/team anglers and those who fished in REAL CLUBS. There where still plenty of real clubs out there but those real clubs NEVER fished for more than token pools! It was all part of how anglers progressed in our sport. You learnt to catch a few fish then joined a different type of club/team.You payed your dues to our sport once you joined a club/team or started fishing open matches if you wanted to learn more and move though the ranks.

Angling has changed massively over the past 25 years. Most of the club/team events have gone or are very small when compared with the past. Many clubs now fish for big pools. In some cases club match pools are bigger than your average open match pools and strangly the money is often not as spread out as your average open match pools with ever smaller sections. Many club/team anglers now fish open matches more often than they fish with there clubs. Some do very well. These anglers are part of the reason for the way small sections and pools are set up in open matches on commercials today. Spread out the money to bring back the pools fodder! Are those anglers club anglers or open match anglers? Its very difficult to say. Gone are the days when clubs fished for trouphies and medels and almost no cash!!!

National competitions designed for club anglers are for big money and/or expensive tackle or even sponsorship. Here lies the problem.

In many anglers minds. Whats the difference between club competitions, club matches and open matches? If your fishing for money and in many cases quite big money. Then your a match angler. If your part of a club. Then. your a club angler. Many are both!!! Its one thing for club anglers to fish the odd open match for a bit of fun or to test themselves and learn. If your fishing for more than a few pounds and a trouphy or medals. Then, you could be called a match angler who fishes with a club. Maybe not a very good one but your still a match angler based on what your fishing for.

I,ve fished in the super cup while i was in a club. It was a team event. So, i was fishing for the club. I was not sponsored at the time and was only just back into angling after a 2 year break. Im not sure i would have got any stick if we had won the competition as the club was just a group of mates of different angling abilities from an established club. We where not a match team set up for just that competition.

I consider myself to be a match angler. So, i dont enter any of the other National club competitions. However, i have fished with a few clubs matches when i have been invited by my mates.

In my opinion there are very few anglers that i believe should not be allowed to fish in these National club competitions. Although, i dont bother myself. Those few anglers that have proper sponsorship deals. Maybe 150 anglers across the country should not be allowed to enter. I dont think they do enter these competitions anyway. Mainly, because they dont need too.They have bigger fish to fry with there own big money competitions. Many of those who you think are sponsored because they have tackle companies name next to there names in the angling press are not in fact really sponsored for very much. They fish in a club/team that has gained a bit of basic sponsorship and the club/teams anglers get a free or cheaper coat and if there very very lucky a bit of free luggage or bait. In reality, most of those anglers are not that good. They just happen to be part of that club/team. Most of the other so called sposored anglers get a little bit of discount from there local tackle shop and thats about it. If i went in to big carpet shop and said i was going to spend £3,000. Im sure i would get 10% off. So, are anglers really getting sponsorship? I would call it a simple discount. Then, those same anglers carry the tackle shops name. If im totally honest. Most of these so called sponsored anglers are not as good as they would like you to think. However, there are a few quality anglers who win on a very regular basis on different venues who never gain any kind of real sponsorship. Funny how it now works! Its not the way it use to be and that the problem!

Tractorboy, im sure the results for each match are put on to a data-base and the County leagues are made up. If you ask the data-base to only count the higher points score for each angler each week. Then, thats what it will do. Very simple to do and no extra work once the data-base is asked to do that task. So, its very workable.

I applaud the Angling Times for running the county champs, over the last 2 years it has been the main reason why I have gone out on the weekend to chase points and try qualify to fish the county semi final

Hi all

Thanks for all your comments.

Firstly, it would be almost impossible to take just the highest point for each angler for each weekend – we have taken this in to great consideration. We have over 8,500 anglers chasing points and it costs nothing for those 8,500 to enter. It is very labour intensive and requires a lot of man hours to get the tables done each week. Picking the top result from each weekend would increase the man hours immensely. Even if we could figure out a formula to do this automatically on the database, some fishery owners submit results a week late – creating more work and potential errors.

As a regards to next year’s competition, hopefully, all details will be in next week’s paper – we are just finalising the last few details with the competition sponsors.

TrueBlue – This year’s final was on two different venues – Packington Somers and Barston. I agree Barston is quite different to a lot of commercial fisheries but Packington is arguably quite similar to a lot of comemrcials across the country having several small pools.

Finally sorry for the slow reply, I was out of the office last week. The County Champs is here to stay. If any of you would like to discuss this further then please email me on [email protected] and I will get back to you asap.

Cheers for putting us in the picture Abi.

Glad its happening again and hope to get a few points.

Not sure TB will be happy but hey you can’t please some. 😀

Unfortunately you can’t please everyone but we can try. There will be a few improvements to the competition next year, which should make the competition even better, and appeal/please even more anglers.

Hi Abbie

What trueblue is saying is quite true. I think you use excel to put together your points? A very simple macro and/or equation could be written to just use the highest points from any one weekend match. Depends if thats what you would prefer the points scoring to be i suppose…

Sorry Abi but thats a poor excuse for not making the change to the rules that would make the competition fairer and better. A very easy program solves the problem of only using the highest points score for each angler, each weekend if more than one points score is in-putted in to a data base. As long as the dates are correct for each result. Then, you can even add results later or add missing results at any time and the program will do the rest. Have a word with someone in your office who has a basic understanding of computer programming and they should be able to set it up in 20 minutes for you. Its simply a case of asking the data base that the Angling Times must already use for the County Champs results to do the task and it will do it for you. Its as simple as that!!!

Barston was the venue i was thinking about, Abi. Barston is a great venue. Its facilities are second to none. Its a venue that i,ve always enjoyed fishing. However, its not your typical commercial venue. With so many commercial venues in the Midlands. Finding venues that are more the norm might be better. Changing the venues for the final every few years might also keep the final fresh and interesting and allow some anglers to feel more comfortable in the final. This thought comes from feedback i,ve had from some of the lads i know who have fished in the County Champs final over the last two years.

I was never attempting to shoot down the County Champs. The competiton is a really good idea and i hope it goes from strength to strength. However, it could be so much better for many if it was fairer. I,ve pointed out how this can be done. The simple change i,ve suggested to the data base and so the rules would allow a lot more match anglers to become part of the competition. That has to be in the best interest of Angling Times and many match anglers.

Hi TB

Yes I understand how Excel can do it and with a little research I’m sure we could find out how to do it (I do have a basic understanding of computer programming).

However, like I said before we do not always get match results on the weekend they are fished – some fisheries ring them in a week later or in batches and they aren’t always dated (they just say either Sat/Sun).

We could then input the new late results in to the tables but the points would be constantly changing causing a lot of confusion for anglers and more queries for us (more man hours – it is a free competition and if any more man hours are spent on CC then a registration could have to be charged which we don’t want to do.)

We print the tables a week later anyway so some points would not be going on until two/three weeks after they have been scored – if that makes sense. As you’ll appreciate we receive hundreds of match results every week. Also at the beginning of the competiton we have a lot of duplicate names on the system eg. A Name, Bag Em’ or A Name, Bait Tech. This could be the same person, they could be different so we leave them separate until anglers register/call us with their queries. If we were to add them and then discover that these were actually two people (it does happen) we would have lost the points because some would have cancelled others out. Also because some results are sent in late (we add the points to the week we receive them if undated) sometimes we get three results go on on a particular weekend when really only two could possibly be fished. If this happens we check the weekend previous/after to make sure only one would have been scored on one of them so the results are genuine. However, we don’t know which of the three results was from the other weekend so would not know the which the highest score was for each weekend.

Also some anglers fish a double on one weekend and none the next (equivalent of one a weekend) because of shift work etc. If we were then to count just one match a weekend these guys would be significantly disadvantaged. For the moment we will be sticking with the weekend/bank holiday matches counts rule.

As regards to the final venue for next year, I am not sure if we have booked the final venue yet so it could well change depending on availability – all details will be in the paper.

As I also said there will be some changes to next years competition which I think a lot of anglers will be happy with. These will be announced in the paper shortly.

TrueBlue wrote:

“Sorry Abi but thats a poor excuse for not making the change to the rules that would make the competition fairer and better”

T.B
With the greatest of respect how would changing “One Result To Count” make it fairer and better??

Why should’nt the anglers that put more into their fishing be able to get more out of it – like most things in life???

What if you are an angler that only fishes every other week does Abi have to change the structure to accomodate this to???

I.M.H.O as a FREE TO ENTER comp for Match Anglers it is run well and offers a little twist to the open match scene, keeps my interest over the winter months etc
People fish more matches than me, some fish less BUT i will continue to support it!

Well done Abi & Angling Times!!

Abi, i,ve never seen a match result in the Angling Times without the date known. Simple answer if you dont know the date a match was fished on is to request it as part of the local correspondents job. Not difficult to request and im sure it already happens anyway. As for anglers fishing under different team/sponsor names. As you have already pointed out. You have to go back and link each anglers results up at a later date. Simply telling the data base that said anglers are the same. The program would then work out the correct points for you taking in to account the higher points score for each weekend. Its not a case of it being difficult to do. Its a case of not wanting it to happen!

Abi said – Also some anglers fish a double on one weekend and none the next (equivalent of one a weekend) because of shift work etc. If we were then to count just one match a weekend these guys would be significantly disadvantaged. For the moment we will be sticking with the weekend/bank holiday matches counts rule.

Its still fairer to more match anglers if only one result counts per weekend. There is always going to be a few anglers who would lose out no matter what the rules are. However, making the competition fairer for the majority has to be better than giving some anglers a massive advantage and making the results in many of the leagues very predictable because the results are based on as much as anything the number of matches they are lucky enough to be able to fish in and potentially pick up double points.

Simon P, read my posts again. I do explain why it would be fairer and so better for more anglers.

Simon P said – Why should’nt the anglers that put more into their fishing be able to get more out of it – like most things in life???

Simon, there is an advantage for those who fish more weekend matches. Twice the advantage of scoring points each weekend for those who are lucky enough to be able to fish on both days of each weekend. So, those anglers are rewarded for there efforts. Point is still that its fairer than it is at the moment.

Simon said – What if you are an angler that only fishes every other week does Abi have to change the structure to accomodate this to???

The argument is that the competition could be much fairer than it is at the moment for those match anglers who fish regularly and on most weekends. Anglers who dont fish matches regularly are never going to be part of this competition. So, they are never going to qualify anyway!

TB – We do not date results in the Angling Times we categorise them by either Midweek/Sat or Sunday. A couple of the results printed are sometimes from the weekend before (eg. late big match results like a winter league or fish o qualifier).
We link anglers points up as we go along – otherwise we wouldn’t be able to get a cumulative total. If at a later date we find out that two anglers points have been merged incorrectly we can not go back and retrieve those points very easily (we get queries every week of anglers wanting to merge points, most are genuine mergers but we get the odd angler telling porkies which we don’t discover until after the new points totals have been published and the other angler in question has picked up on this.
I don’t know how many match anglers can only fish one day a weekend because of work commitments. We haven’t received many complaints about taking two results a weekend, only a handful – if we were to receive a significant number we would look in to this further. For next year’s competition all weekend and bank holiday matches will count.
Arguably Simon P is correct, and when discussing taking one result a weekend with other anglers they have made similar comments.

The thing is TB and you should know this because you are a seasoned match angler, it isn’t luck that allows anglers to fish twice in a weekend. Its determination and will. The way I see it is, and what i liked about the competition in its original format is that is was non exclusive. You just got on with your fishing and if you were good enough, you might have got into the top 20, and if you weren’t, then well it just wasn’t meant to be. The cream always rises to the top and as with most things, those that put the most in make their own luck. Fair play to them.

Baitchef your above comments are a wined up I presume?if not then you are everything that is wrong with match fishing today

I must agree with Simon P. I do not think counting just one result is fairer. If a person puts the time in on a weekend they should be rewarded, if gaining points.

Sorry what did ‘Baitchef’ say that was so ‘wrong’? :confused:

Abi, it would not be difficult to request the date each match was fished on. That would solve a lot of issues and in effect solve many of your problems. Where there is a will, there is always a way!

Baitchef, im not knocking the ideas behind the competition. When the competition was first discussed a few years ago on here. I was one of those who said what a great idea it was and i was really looking forward to taking part. Its still a great idea but in my opinion the way the competition runs and the way the points are awarded need looking at to make it fairer to all match anglers. If you want the competition to be for only those who are lucky enough to be able to fish most weekends on both Saturday and Sunday. Then, great. However, that was not what the competition set out to achive. Its not difficult to make it fairer. There just needs to be the want to make it better than it is at the moment.

Most anglers fish once each weekend. FBlues stated this on his radio show only last weekend! A lucky few are able to fish more often that this. That in my opinion undermines what i belived the County Champs set out to achive.

If you agree with Baitchef, Simon P and Andycarpcatcher, then why not give points to those who fish mid-week open matches that are published in the Angling Times as well? There only being rewarded for the hard work they put in to fish on extra days. That would really show the true strength of anglers in each area(i think not)!

I could give you the top 20 anglers in many areas that i fish opens before the competition starts in 2012. As it stands, it would be based on how often these anglers fish open matches and which venues these anglers fish open matches on. That cannot be good for the competition when in effect the competition is only open to those who regularly fish on both weekend days! Those double points scoring weeknds make a massive difference to the result in most leagues.

Me not going fishing twice or more a week has got nothing to do with lack of determination or will,more like family,work,funds.And the cream as baitchef calls them need to realise that without us lesser anglers match fishing would not be what it is today.If matchfishing was about proving who was the best then most of us may as well stop going.

I think anyone that is good enough to win regularly should be commended, congratulated and appreciated for their ability(depending on their character). No matter if they are a venue expert or doing it at many different venues. We are talking about contests after all.
I think everyone has restrictions and hindrances on their ability to go fishing as much as they like..we call it life. We all have to deal with these constraints and I feel no resentment for those who get on the bank more often than I do.

Guys sorry if my post has come across the wrong way. I’m not trying to say that those of us who choose to only fish once per week are any less determined or have less will power or skill. What i’m trying to say is that it isn’t luck that allows an angler to fish twice in a weekend. They have made thier own choice, as i choose not to based on my circumstances. The only thing stopping me from doing so is me, its my choice. I know a few guys who fish 2 maybe 3 times a week and I don’t have a problem with it and don’t think they have an unfair advantage. They have made the decision that’s what they want to do with thier life and fair play.
Maybee down here its not as competitive as it is up north, in as much as there are less of us here?
Also lets not forget, it isn’t costing us anything to enter and personally i would just fish my usual matches and not specifically target the county champs.

Anyway I barely fish nowadays, that’s probably why i think like i do. I might do a bit more next year and maybe my opinion might change.

Abi wrote “Yes I understand how Excel can do it and with a little research I’m sure we could find out how to do it (I do have a basic understanding of computer programming). “

As a database programmer by profession I have to say that Excel is totally unsuited to this type of job. It may enable the data to be recorded but real data management is not its strength.

If AT are to keep the County Champs running for the next couple of years then an investment in writing a small database application to do the job would ultimately pay dividends.

The analysis that could then be undertaken on the data would be bound only by the imagination of the people asking the questions.

Abi,
Glad that the AT County Champs is happing again and would like to thank you and your team at AT for putting the time and effort in. I wouldnt worry about the moaners on here.
At the end of the day its free to all anglers its not like you have to put your hand in your pocket and pay to register is it?
For those that dont like it thats easy dont register for it or come up with your own version and run your own County Champs simples.
At the end off the day there is alot of time and effort put into the this already you cant expect Abi and the team to work 24/7 on it they do have lives as well.
As been said in the past we as anglers are our own worse enemy at times always moaning about how certain things should be ran and moaning if there wasnt things like the county champs being run.
Can not please some people 😮 😮 😮 😮 😮 😮

@gloves007uk wrote:

Abi,
Glad that the AT County Champs is happing again and would like to thank you and your team at AT for putting the time and effort in. I wouldnt worry about the moaners on here.
At the end of the day its free to all anglers its not like you have to put your money in your pocket and pay to register is it?
For those that dont like it thats easy dont register for it or come up with your own version and run your own County Champs simples.
At the end off the day there is alot of timeand effort put into the this already you cant expect Abi and the team to work 24/7 on it they do have lives as well.
As been said in the past we as anglers are our own worse enemy at times always moaning about how certain things should be ran and moaning if ther wasnt things like the county champs being run.
Can not please some people 😮 😮 😮 😮 😮 😮

Good post Chris 😎 😎

Just found the data base for last years County Champs. Very interesting reading.

http://www.gofishing.co.uk/Angling-Times/Section/News–Catches/County-Champs/