big thank you to our bankers

[TF_herbie]

we give them 850 billion.~think
they give us 2.5 billion back in taxes.~clap.
then pay themselves 7 billion in bonuses. ~think

bloody good buisness i say well done chaps.
could someone pop next door and tell mrs bates ( 87) that she,s got no dinner this week as weve got a deficit to reduce, and its no use being ill the hospitals closed to save money cos we have a deficit init. so best die quickly and reduce the surplus population ~naughty bloody old people~naughty

the top bank bosses wont get a bonus ~sick just shares and to realy punish them they cant cash them in for three years. now anyone who fails to see the irony in this must be a banker .our money used to inflate the banks share prices with the target being 2014. then sell sell sell ~clap ~clap share price collapses and we the stupid people give them more money and the cycle continue,s. we must have sucker written all over our foreheads.

[TF_MARKHLDAS]

~hand Sod Off Errrrrrrbie I’m a bank worker and if my performance is awarded a bonus I bloody well deserve it !

[TF_proper tidal boy]

sorry hathers NO ??????SHORT WORKING DAY long lunchbreaks massive hols and overpaid, and ontop of that shares and spoils of the system at the exspense of those that pay a high privilege for allowing the banks to look after there money i dont think so?????

[TF_MARKHLDAS]

My day starts at 7:30 and ends at 6 and lunch whats that. It’s the greedy consumer that F*****d the economy and now I have to do a 50 hour week to re-build it!

[TF_MARKHLDAS]

My day starts at 7:30 and ends at 6 and lunch whats that. It’s the greedy consumer that F*****d the economy and now I have to do a 50 hour week to re-build it!

[TF_tewton]

@herbie wrote:

.

and don’t forget no public toilets because the councils can’t afford to run them after the tory cuts

[himoverthereParticipant]

@herbie wrote:

we give them 850 billion.~think
they give us 2.5 billion back in taxes.~clap.
then pay themselves 7 billion in bonuses. ~think

bloody good buisness i say well done chaps.
could someone pop next door and tell mrs bates ( 87) that she,s got no dinner this week as weve got a deficit to reduce, and its no use being ill the hospitals closed to save money cos we have a deficit init. so best die quickly and reduce the surplus population ~naughty bloody old people~naughty

the top bank bosses wont get a bonus ~sick just shares and to realy punish them they cant cash them in for three years. now anyone who fails to see the irony in this must be a banker .our money used to inflate the banks share prices with the target being 2014. then sell sell sell ~clap ~clap share price collapses and we the stupid people give them more money and the cycle continue,s. we must have sucker written all over our foreheads.

try getting some facts fella ~naughty

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Why what was wrong with what Herbie posted?

Cracking post IMO ~clap

The new government is gutless. The Banking system, the whole system should have been made to pay back much more. Even banks that did not take money directly from the then Government still benefitted enormously from the actions aimed to keep the country afloat.

We have been shafted by the bankers and the coalition.

[TF_herbie]

affers your in a job because we the people gave you 850 billion to prop you up. now pupils at a handicaped school with very special needs have had £60,000 cut from there budget. 6 no staff lost there jobs because our glorious banking system gambled these kids welfare and future away on some crooked property deals in america. these banks should have been allowed to fail and the 850 billion put into creating jobs. thats something i would,nt mind having my budget cut for. as for facts they came directly from our no 1 crook murdoch. i can only quote what he wrote because he owns all our media, the share,s our big boys are getting came direct from the chancellors mouth at 1400hrs 9/2/11.you may work for a bank mark but i dont hold you personally responsable just your bent system that rewards failier. to award yourselves 7 billion on top of your already inflated wages is taking the piss and if allowed to continue will be the undoing of this once proud nation. i rest my case because to continue would serve no purpose other than to alienate friends. today i have yet more meetings where no doubt more jobs will be lost. thats low paid jobs and the tax payer will have to make up the losses there incomes generated thus more deficit.more family,s on the floor no doubt about to be charged over inflated fines from there local friendly bank because they have no money. and so it begins a society dating back to 1800 haves and have nots.mark these people did not create the problem but there dam well paying for it.

[TF_piperpilot]

Just who gave these useless bankers the 850B in the first place. Just like any other business banks should be allowed to go bankrupt. Merchant bankers the lot of them including all those thieving Blue Yellow and Red scumbags in Westminster,

[TF_piperpilot]

Talk about shooting itself in the foot as a tiny slice of that fat greedy merchant bankers 850 Billion pi55 it up the wall party fund would have got our world beating ‘Hotol project’ off the drawing board and put this country into the forefront of aerospace technology. But then again who cares about the sucess of the UK when compared to flash houses flash cars whores and non stop buckets off ice cold champagne which naturally tastes all the better when some other mug is paying for it, Long live the bamks. YEA!! RIGHT,

[TF_piperpilot]

Hail the cuts.

No Nimrods
No Harriers
No Aircraft Carriers
Etc! Etc!! Etc!!!
Servicemen issued with third rate kit who spend their own meager wages on far superior equipment from Army surplus stores. ‘HAIL THE BANKERS & POLITICO’s’ as they truly deserve their Lambo’s Ferrari’s Penthouses and Pro’s, Pull the ladder up,

[TF_kid_a]

What is the alternative to the cuts??? Spend spend spend, the reason we got into this mess in the first place 13 years of labour…..?

[himoverthereParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Why what was wrong with what Herbie posted?

Lets see for a start he has posted what SOME banks have taken in the bail out. But posted the combined bonus pot for all the banks including them that have taken nothing?????

should staff of the banks that have taken nothing and hit targets not get their bonus?

[TF_dirkdiggler]

in my own experience as a small business owner
i’d say by far the worst thing about the banks at the moment is their absolute refusal to help small business at all.
i’ve applied for a business loan from barclays,rbs and santander and guess what you don’t even get the courtesy of a phone call back to tell you to get bent.

the thing that really gets my panties in a bunch is how they all pretend to be helping the private sector businesses at the moment to grow and accomodate the public sector jobs which are being caned.
i tell you every time i see that frikkin advert for barclays helping the little shoe factory i’am spitting food at the tv.

[bigroachParticipant]

herbie your my hero.

the way i see it no one working for the banks should have a bonus or a payrise until every single penny is paid back with the interest.Why should i/we have to pay for there stupid lending….

[himoverthereParticipant]

@bigroach wrote:

herbie your my hero.

the way i see it no one working for the banks should have a bonus or a payrise until every single penny is paid back with the interest.Why should i/we have to pay for there stupid lending….

and the banks that aint taken nothing? how about their staff? all the complaints about bob diamond and his bonus barclays aint had no rescue so are they ok to pay a bonus?

[TF_MARKHLDAS]

~clap Just got my Bonus! No really I have…9.5%. That should mean I buy Casters this weekend instead of Maggots

[TF_Jadstar70]

Can those that are very “anti City banks”, do you know what these insitutions actually contribute to our economy on a % term basis? In relation to all other industries?

Would you rather they werent here and moved to India or Kuala Lumpa, or Germany for instance?

What effect do you think this would have on the country as a whole, and how would you propose the fiscal hole left by these financial institutions, leaving the UK to operate, would to be filled?~think ~think

Just curious…

[TF_Stevie H]

@MARKHLDAS wrote:

~clap Just got my Bonus! No really I have…9.5%. That should mean I buy Casters this weekend instead of Maggots

Nice one! All I got out of this was a 2 year pay freeze! My bonus will probably end up in the form of a 6 month tour of a sandy place with unsuitable equipment, for which the government will pay me an extra 10 quid a day for risking my life…….

End of rant!

[TF_fishcatcher4]

herbie is right about this although he could even have gone further.the position we are in now is 99% the banks fault,they lent money to people who couldnt pay it back and sold these mortgages to each other in blocks at inflated rates,so all the banks were paying each other vast profits.it was like a carousel and when the carousel stopped (when the people couldnt pay the loans back)it was the banks who were left holding most of the debts who we had to bail out.who do you think is now lending the government the money for the deficit at inflated interest rates,you guessed it the banks.you couldnt make it up.there shouldnt be any cuts it should be the banks who should pay all the money back,not cutting care to the vulnerable and the poorer people.all in it together my arse.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@Jadstar70 wrote:

Can those that are very “anti City banks”, do you know what these insitutions actually contribute to our economy on a % term basis? In relation to all other industries?

Would you rather they werent here and moved to India or Kuala Lumpa, or Germany for instance?

What effect do you think this would have on the country as a whole, and how would you propose the fiscal hole left by these financial institutions, leaving the UK to operate, would to be filled?~think ~think

Just curious…

Your point is?

We were told by our wonderful bankers that if we did not bail them out they would lose everything. We helped them and put ourselves in a huge mess that ordinary people are now paying for whilst the bankers take the P eextracting large profilts and ludicrous bonuses.

Whatever happened to a society where one good turn deserves another. From where I am standing it is akin to finding a mans wallet containing 10K, giving it to him and receiving 1p in return.

[himoverthereParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@Jadstar70 wrote:

Can those that are very “anti City banks”, do you know what these insitutions actually contribute to our economy on a % term basis? In relation to all other industries?

Would you rather they werent here and moved to India or Kuala Lumpa, or Germany for instance?

What effect do you think this would have on the country as a whole, and how would you propose the fiscal hole left by these financial institutions, leaving the UK to operate, would to be filled?~think ~think

Just curious…

Your point is?

We were told by our wonderful bankers that if we did not bail them out they would lose everything. We helped them and put ourselves in a huge mess that ordinary people are now paying for whilst the bankers take the P eextracting large profilts and ludicrous bonuses.

Whatever happened to a society where one good turn deserves another. From where I am standing it is akin to finding a mans wallet containing 10K, giving it to him and receiving 1p in return.

and what was the choice other than bail SOME banks out? a bank is a business plain and simple and they have to reward the best staff to keep them.

[himoverthereParticipant]

@Stevie H wrote:

@MARKHLDAS wrote:

~clap Just got my Bonus! No really I have…9.5%. That should mean I buy Casters this weekend instead of Maggots

Nice one! All I got out of this was a 2 year pay freeze! My bonus will probably end up in the form of a 6 month tour of a sandy place with unsuitable equipment, for which the government will pay me an extra 10 quid a day for risking my life…….

End of rant!

dont mind me asking but you did chose your job did you?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@Jadstar70 wrote:

Can those that are very “anti City banks”, do you know what these insitutions actually contribute to our economy on a % term basis? In relation to all other industries?

Would you rather they werent here and moved to India or Kuala Lumpa, or Germany for instance?

What effect do you think this would have on the country as a whole, and how would you propose the fiscal hole left by these financial institutions, leaving the UK to operate, would to be filled?~think ~think

Just curious…

Your point is?

We were told by our wonderful bankers that if we did not bail them out they would lose everything. We helped them and put ourselves in a huge mess that ordinary people are now paying for whilst the bankers take the P eextracting large profilts and ludicrous bonuses.

Whatever happened to a society where one good turn deserves another. From where I am standing it is akin to finding a mans wallet containing 10K, giving it to him and receiving 1p in return.

and what was the choice other than bail SOME banks out? a bank is a business plain and simple and they have to reward the best staff to keep them.

Are you a banker

I have no problem with bailing the banks out. I also hate this notion we only helped specific banks. Every banks benefitted enormously by the Govt pumping our money into the economy and keeping people in work and solvent.

I have a huge problem with helping somebody out and they then take the P in return. The Banking Sector owes the British people and until that is repaid then bonuses etc should not be paid out. I love this we have to pay bonuses to retain staff. Poppycock 1) Their recent record suggests they are not that good and more importantly 2) Nobody is irreplaceable. ANYBODY / EVERYBODY can be replaced.

By taking the P the Banking Sector has lost any respect / trust it once had.

[himoverthereParticipant]

No am no longer a banker but my wife is. How long then do the banks who never got any direct funding go holding bonus payments until then if they have nothing to pay back? or is this jus no more. I get a bonus in my new job why should everyone else not?

as for the banks not getting direct funding but still benefiting. most of the businesses in this country benefit from this so should no business give a bonus?

simple facts are this government had to bail out the banks. no other government would have left them to collapse as the country would have gone bust. and the bonus keeps the best bankers and the better bankers make more for the banks in turn paying the tax payer back. Oh and may i add all the loans will be paid back with profit i would bet.

[Anonymous]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPWH5TlbloU ..its american,but you get the idea

[TF_Stevie H]

@himoverthere wrote:

@Stevie H wrote:

@MARKHLDAS wrote:

~clap Just got my Bonus! No really I have…9.5%. That should mean I buy Casters this weekend instead of Maggots

Nice one! All I got out of this was a 2 year pay freeze! My bonus will probably end up in the form of a 6 month tour of a sandy place with unsuitable equipment, for which the government will pay me an extra 10 quid a day for risking my life…….

End of rant!

dont mind me asking but you did chose your job did you?

HoT,

Yes I did, and I am proud to have served my country for over 21 years. Can you be proud of contributing to the countries economical mess that it finds itself in?

[himoverthereParticipant]

@Stevie H wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@Stevie H wrote:

@MARKHLDAS wrote:

~clap Just got my Bonus! No really I have…9.5%. That should mean I buy Casters this weekend instead of Maggots

Nice one! All I got out of this was a 2 year pay freeze! My bonus will probably end up in the form of a 6 month tour of a sandy place with unsuitable equipment, for which the government will pay me an extra 10 quid a day for risking my life…….

End of rant!

dont mind me asking but you did chose your job did you?

HoT,

Yes I did, and I am proud to have served my country for over 21 years. Can you be proud of contributing to the countries economical mess that it finds itself in?

sorry but what have i done?

[TF_Stevie H]

@himoverthere wrote:

@Stevie H wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@Stevie H wrote:

@MARKHLDAS wrote:

~clap Just got my Bonus! No really I have…9.5%. That should mean I buy Casters this weekend instead of Maggots

Nice one! All I got out of this was a 2 year pay freeze! My bonus will probably end up in the form of a 6 month tour of a sandy place with unsuitable equipment, for which the government will pay me an extra 10 quid a day for risking my life…….

End of rant!

dont mind me asking but you did chose your job did you?

HoT,

Yes I did, and I am proud to have served my country for over 21 years. Can you be proud of contributing to the countries economical mess that it finds itself in?

sorry but what have i done?

Probably nothing, but you did mention that you were a banker and these are some of the people to blame for the mess we are in. I have nothing against you personally, but you were the one who jumped on the bandwagon when I commented on MARKHLDAS’s quote.

[TF_Decaff]

My wife worked for Lloyds TSB for over 28yrs up until a Labour Govt instigated & insisted(not to eveyones knowledge) that Lloyds & HBOS merge.Why? Lloyds were swimming along quite nicely on their own accord,now they have closed branches,made thousands un – employed(which Govt money or ours,whichever way you look at it has funded) & sadddled a Bank with a mountain of bad investment,debt,uncertainty & a tarnished reputation.Why?In my wifes case she lost her job probably because her working conditions were too good,holiday,pension,healthcare etc.She was passed over for a HBOS employee who’s salary & conditions were far below hers.
I think thre’s a lot more to it than Bankers bonus’s. I’m not going to blame them all just yet!

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@himoverthere wrote:

No am no longer a banker but my wife is. How long then do the banks who never got any direct funding go holding bonus payments until then if they have nothing to pay back? or is this jus no more. I get a bonus in my new job why should everyone else not?

as for the banks not getting direct funding but still benefiting. most of the businesses in this country benefit from this so should no business give a bonus?

simple facts are this government had to bail out the banks. no other government would have left them to collapse as the country would have gone bust. and the bonus keeps the best bankers and the better bankers make more for the banks in turn paying the tax payer back. Oh and may i add all the loans will be paid back with profit i would bet.

As I say this is a red herring spun by the bankers. Apparently there are less and less jobs available in banking, anybody can be replaced. If person X goes guess what the man/woman below him will step up and do the same job, and the person under that etc etc.

Like the rest of us the bankers should be damn grateful they still have jobs. JOBS THAT BANKERS INCOMPETENCE THREATENED / COST IN SOME CASES.

Simple test KILL THE OTT BONUSES and see what happens. IMO, nothing will change, no deterioration. Not that they could get any worse could they?

[TF_fishcatcher4]

couldnt agree more.

[TF_MARKHLDAS]

British Banks are underpinned from Delhi and the Indian Government are more than happy with the greed of the european consumer who are contributing to the new wealth of their country.

SH-It must be tough but I can’t influence anything by just doing my job. The same as I can’t help Herbies issue with school funding. We make choices in life and maybe Mr.Blair made a big mistake.

[TF_proper tidal boy]

on that case hathers do you answer the banks phone when it rings, unlike your mobile which you are ignoring ??????? or are you blanking me lol

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

On that basis surely the banks should be screwed by our Government/Country because without our help they were screwed.

The piddling amounts they are being taxed/repaying are taking the people of Britain as fools.

[TF_peter9000uk]

@piperpilot wrote:

Hail the cuts.

No Nimrods
No Harriers
No Aircraft Carriers

You missed the TSR2

[TF_piperpilot]

Now Now Peter don’t get me started on the best Aeroplane the world has ever seen. I have a Jeroboam of Bollinger ready and waiting to celebrate when that piece of filth who cancelled our world beating project snuffs it,

[TF_wightangler]

Can’t believe Cameron ,Osborn and their investment banking chums when they go on about the inherited Labour national debt from bailing out the banks after 2009 crash.
Most investment or casino sector banking is made on the 1987 de-regularised system of massive collateral obligation borrowings- that’s err debt!
Whilst it works when ‘confidence’ prevails- overvalueing and the inevitable pulling of the rest of the domestic economy into it and can force short term measures that hamper longer term and necessary inward investment and small business borrowing. Which is given higher interest rates than intra bank loans for derrivative options in effectively a 2 tier system. The tax return from this sector is small given the net effect on internal and export national industrial and commercial development and the innovative green economy companies have mostly been starved of capital investment- particuarly compared to us and india precisely because interrim and long term borrowing necessary for domestic economy development is seen as ‘high -risk’ wheras intra -bank and investment banking options and derrivatives ‘low’ as the short term speculative profit effectively means performance and profit based bonuses – an offset system thus effectively having a self-evident stake in speculation at the expense of the real economy- and political influence as a result of own interest politicians- mostly coalition who make personal profit or former part professional involvement from the system which, like ‘brag’ favours the biggest who can then borrow the largest. Greed is not good as an ethos and surely leads to a narrow focus without the legal consequence and duty of care placed on the rest of the economy and citizens.
Lack of international concerted regulation must also be a concern- since you can hardly blame the mainly ordinary self-employed personnel as that’s what they are paid to do- mostly well- within the fs system.
The system cannot predict another failure of confidence at some future stage and dependancy upon its narrow speculative focus has lead to probably 50% of the increase in food prices despite bad harvests in some states.
If this sector continues to grow by its inexhorable swallow of the other sectors then real global problems and crises will inevitably occur since the borrowing capabillity and speculative preponderences of the super banks can really hold to ransom independant national govts. in real economic policy and genuine development for their respective populations since national govts. are increasingly bit players and the individual national bond market and values by same process vulnerable to concerted aggressive speculation which by nastuture short term profit motivated and seemingly ‘immune’ from domestic national consequence that falls on the average citizen.
The bonuses are a structural part of the system and cannot be easily ammended or divorced from that without international and banking sector agreement on much needed liquidity safeguards and a re-balancing of the whole system.
Realistically, widespread popular unrest as in Egypt& Tunisia are the only real likelihood of forcing any change or re-balancing which will require international agreement and binding legislation.

[himoverthereParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

No am no longer a banker but my wife is. How long then do the banks who never got any direct funding go holding bonus payments until then if they have nothing to pay back? or is this jus no more. I get a bonus in my new job why should everyone else not?

as for the banks not getting direct funding but still benefiting. most of the businesses in this country benefit from this so should no business give a bonus?

simple facts are this government had to bail out the banks. no other government would have left them to collapse as the country would have gone bust. and the bonus keeps the best bankers and the better bankers make more for the banks in turn paying the tax payer back. Oh and may i add all the loans will be paid back with profit i would bet.

As I say this is a red herring spun by the bankers. Apparently there are less and less jobs available in banking, anybody can be replaced. If person X goes guess what the man/woman below him will step up and do the same job, and the person under that etc etc.

Like the rest of us the bankers should be damn grateful they still have jobs. JOBS THAT BANKERS INCOMPETENCE THREATENED / COST IN SOME CASES.

Simple test KILL THE OTT BONUSES and see what happens. IMO, nothing will change, no deterioration. Not that they could get any worse could they?

if it was that easy to replace the top earner with the one below why is the one below not above? and i have said before the government is charging for the lending. it is not interest free lending.

[TF_yorkshire]

@MARKHLDAS wrote:

~hand Sod Off Errrrrrrbie I’m a bank worker and if my performance is awarded a bonus I bloody well deserve it !

hmmmmm good job it isnt based on team fishing performance~shh

[himoverthereParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

but if you dont want to borrow you dont have to. simple aint it. we all make choices and the terms are in front of you before you sign.

[TF_lloydy1970]

How many on here thought it was great when their house was increasing in value and you could borrow more money then more money against it.GREED bankers,buisnesses and everyone who lived the life because THE BANKS AND GOUVERNMENT let you borrow more money than you can afford to pay back. The banks knew the bottom would fall out of property because 1st time buyers couldn’t keep borrowing more than they were going to earn in 15 years.u

[TF_kid_a]

Exactly how many of the baby boomer generation re-mortgaged there over inflated houses? Did the banks force them to do it? Or was it their own stupidity?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

but if you dont want to borrow you dont have to. simple aint it. we all make choices and the terms are in front of you before you sign.

How many / what % of people do not have to borrow money in their lives? Perhaps a nation built on house ownership is not a good thing. Irrespective, financial institutions have a duty to manage OUR money sensibly and with little risk.

A previous poster said why does the person below not replace the one above. I cannot even believe he does know the answer. Those at the top block those below in part by simply holding the post but also for fear that person is better than they are. Nobody is irreplaceable.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@kid_a wrote:

Exactly how many of the baby boomer generation re-mortgaged there over inflated houses? Did the banks force them to do it? Or was it their own stupidity?

The banks were supposed to check such stupidity. They never did and even made it worse with 100% or 100%+ mortgages.

I think bankers should be stoned or put in the stocks. Bonuses? Not a chance.

[TF_kid_a]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@kid_a wrote:

Exactly how many of the baby boomer generation re-mortgaged there over inflated houses? Did the banks force them to do it? Or was it their own stupidity?

The banks were supposed to check such stupidity. They never did and even made it worse with 100% or 100%+ mortgages.

I think bankers should be stoned or put in the stocks. Bonuses? Not a chance.

So you want a nanny state where people are told what to do and cant make their own decisions/mistakes?

[TF_Dodge]

People are far far more important than any bank or banker , sadly this Tory coalition doesnt care one jot about us ! hey quite a lot of us knew this anyway and said so on this forum this time last year , after all the tories always do this dont they ! ~naughty ~naughty ~naughty

[TF_kid_a]

@Dodge wrote:

People are far far more important than any bank or banker , sadly this Tory coalition doesnt care one jot about us ! hey quite a lot of us knew this anyway and said so on this forum this time last year , after all the tories always do this dont they ! ~naughty ~naughty ~naughty

It was labour that made this mess!! The trouble is Labour make the mess but dont hang around long enough to clean up after themselves…

Dont kid yourself Labour arent the champions of the people!

[TF_Dodge]

@kid_a wrote:

@Dodge wrote:

People are far far more important than any bank or banker , sadly this Tory coalition doesnt care one jot about us ! hey quite a lot of us knew this anyway and said so on this forum this time last year , after all the tories always do this dont they ! ~naughty ~naughty ~naughty

It was labour that made this mess!! The trouble is Labour make the mess but dont hang around long enough to clean up after themselves…

Dont kid yourself Labour arent the champions of the people!

Wow ! not that old tory chesnut !

Two tier Britian , north / south divide …. its happening again right now, GET REAL ~shh

[himoverthereParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

but if you dont want to borrow you dont have to. simple aint it. we all make choices and the terms are in front of you before you sign.

How many / what % of people do not have to borrow money in their lives? Perhaps a nation built on house ownership is not a good thing. Irrespective, financial institutions have a duty to manage OUR money sensibly and with little risk.

A previous poster said why does the person below not replace the one above. I cannot even believe he does know the answer. Those at the top block those below in part by simply holding the post but also for fear that person is better than they are. Nobody is irreplaceable.

100% of people do not HAVE to borrow but most choose to do so. as for your theory regarding the top bankers blocking the way for the rest you are wrong. my point is there are many bankers doing the same job and some are better than others. the better ones get the bigger bonus. (I know this for a fact as i have been there and done it). the reason they get the bigger bonus is directly linked to performance so why not pay the bonus to keep the best performing staff? you and i both know they as you would will leave for a bank that will give a bonus if they dont get one.

I do see your point about the bank lending over the amount that some one should borrow. but you have got to say its not just the banks fault as the customer should know their limits.

after all would you borrow more than you could afford?

[himoverthereParticipant]

@kid_a wrote:

@Dodge wrote:

People are far far more important than any bank or banker , sadly this Tory coalition doesnt care one jot about us ! hey quite a lot of us knew this anyway and said so on this forum this time last year , after all the tories always do this dont they ! ~naughty ~naughty ~naughty

It was labour that made this mess!! The trouble is Labour make the mess but dont hang around long enough to clean up after themselves…

Dont kid yourself Labour arent the champions of the people!

Can you really say the banks should have been left to go bust?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

but if you dont want to borrow you dont have to. simple aint it. we all make choices and the terms are in front of you before you sign.

How many / what % of people do not have to borrow money in their lives? Perhaps a nation built on house ownership is not a good thing. Irrespective, financial institutions have a duty to manage OUR money sensibly and with little risk.

A previous poster said why does the person below not replace the one above. I cannot even believe he does know the answer. Those at the top block those below in part by simply holding the post but also for fear that person is better than they are. Nobody is irreplaceable.

100% of people do not HAVE to borrow but most choose to do so. as for your theory regarding the top bankers blocking the way for the rest you are wrong. my point is there are many bankers doing the same job and some are better than others. the better ones get the bigger bonus. (I know this for a fact as i have been there and done it). the reason they get the bigger bonus is directly linked to performance so why not pay the bonus to keep the best performing staff? you and i both know they as you would will leave for a bank that will give a bonus if they dont get one.

I do see your point about the bank lending over the amount that some one should borrow. but you have got to say its not just the banks fault as the customer should know their limits.

after all would you borrow more than you could afford?

I would not sell alcohol to an alcoholic or cigarettes to a cancer sufferer.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@kid_a wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@kid_a wrote:

Exactly how many of the baby boomer generation re-mortgaged there over inflated houses? Did the banks force them to do it? Or was it their own stupidity?

The banks were supposed to check such stupidity. They never did and even made it worse with 100% or 100%+ mortgages.

I think bankers should be stoned or put in the stocks. Bonuses? Not a chance.

So you want a nanny state where people are told what to do and cant make their own decisions/mistakes?

LOL So you want anarchy then, scrap laws / rules / regulations and let us have a free for all.

A society that cares and protects for all members of that society is far more advanced than your desired vision.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

“LOL So you want anarchy then, scrap laws / rules / regulations and let us have a free for all.”

Not anarchy, survival of the fittest and some individual responsibility (as in not borrowing what you cannot afford to repay).

The banks didn’t need to check “such stupidity” until mad Gordon relaxed borrowing criteria and allowed self-certification of earnings through the creation of his own personal Frankenstein, the FSA.

“A society that cares and protects for all members of that society is far more advanced than your desired vision.”

Disagree.

The Victorians advanced at a much greater rate than we are doing because they weren’t handicapped with all this nannying and red tape.

[himoverthereParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@kid_a wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@kid_a wrote:

Exactly how many of the baby boomer generation re-mortgaged there over inflated houses? Did the banks force them to do it? Or was it their own stupidity?

The banks were supposed to check such stupidity. They never did and even made it worse with 100% or 100%+ mortgages.

I think bankers should be stoned or put in the stocks. Bonuses? Not a chance.

So you want a nanny state where people are told what to do and cant make their own decisions/mistakes?

LOL So you want anarchy then, scrap laws / rules / regulations and let us have a free for all.

A society that cares and protects for all members of that society is far more advanced than your desired vision.

you suggest you need protecting from your self?

and i see you chose to ignore most of my last points.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@caster rob wrote:

“LOL So you want anarchy then, scrap laws / rules / regulations and let us have a free for all.”

Not anarchy, survival of the fittest and some individual responsibility (as in not borrowing what you cannot afford to repay).

Nature mananges this without anarchy.

“A society that cares and protects for all members of that society is far more advanced than your desired vision.”

Disagree.

The Victorians advanced at a much greater rate than we are doing because they weren’t handicapped with all this nannying and red tape.

Incorrect Rob. I told you a while back to watch the Age of the do gooders. You clearly did not do so. Hence, your education has suffered.

Our past generations believed in EVERYBODY putting something back into society, they did not believe in anybody being reliant upon welfare. Past generations believed if you helped people, made them feel proud of themselves and their region then we would create a far better society for all to live in. Past generations had far higher standards than we have today.

The key reason for this concern was the fear of rebellion an violence. Even today that fear drives our leaders on to demand chane as in Egypt. Ludicrously hypocritical to see Coalition politicians welcoming social disobedience in Eqypt because it would bring about change yet castigating much smaller scale protests in their own backyard.

Survival of the fittest went out with the cavemen Rob and it never worked. Silly!!

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@kid_a wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@kid_a wrote:

Exactly how many of the baby boomer generation re-mortgaged there over inflated houses? Did the banks force them to do it? Or was it their own stupidity?

The banks were supposed to check such stupidity. They never did and even made it worse with 100% or 100%+ mortgages.

I think bankers should be stoned or put in the stocks. Bonuses? Not a chance.

So you want a nanny state where people are told what to do and cant make their own decisions/mistakes?

LOL So you want anarchy then, scrap laws / rules / regulations and let us have a free for all.

A society that cares and protects for all members of that society is far more advanced than your desired vision.

you suggest you need protecting from your self?

and i see you chose to ignore most of my last points.

We all need protecting from ourselves.

Without laws I would drive very dangerously

Every working day I protect 80% of young people from themselves. Every government demands it no matter what their political allegiance.

Society is constantly being protected from its own stupidity including You and all the other misguided capitalists here.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

“Survival of the fittest went out with the cavemen Rob and it never worked. Silly!! “

If that were true we wouldn’t have evolved beyond cave-dwelling.

Now that’s silly.

If you think my education ahs “suffered” what’s your take on some of the pigin-English garbage posted above?

You’ve not proferred an opinion on that – strange.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

“Society is constantly being protected from its own stupidity including You and all the other misguided capitalists here.”

Wealth-cretaion is now misguided?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

but if you dont want to borrow you dont have to. simple aint it. we all make choices and the terms are in front of you before you sign.

How many / what % of people do not have to borrow money in their lives? Perhaps a nation built on house ownership is not a good thing. Irrespective, financial institutions have a duty to manage OUR money sensibly and with little risk.

A previous poster said why does the person below not replace the one above. I cannot even believe he does know the answer. Those at the top block those below in part by simply holding the post but also for fear that person is better than they are. Nobody is irreplaceable.

100% of people do not HAVE to borrow but most choose to do so. as for your theory regarding the top bankers blocking the way for the rest you are wrong. my point is there are many bankers doing the same job and some are better than others. the better ones get the bigger bonus. (I know this for a fact as i have been there and done it). the reason they get the bigger bonus is directly linked to performance so why not pay the bonus to keep the best performing staff? you and i both know they as you would will leave for a bank that will give a bonus if they dont get one.

I do see your point about the bank lending over the amount that some one should borrow. but you have got to say its not just the banks fault as the customer should know their limits.

after all would you borrow more than you could afford?

I hope you realise how laughable it is as an ex banker to chastise Joe Public for how they spend their OWN MONEY when bankers so willfully and incredulously squandered JOE PUBLIC’S MONEY and then have the gaul to suggest they deserve bonuses.

One of the pro banker posters in their nanny state rhetoric post said should we protect people from themselves. Indeed we should but even more from bankers.

Every man / jack working in the banking sector should be thoroughly embarassed by the way their colleagues have mis managed OUR MONEY and plummeted the reputation of the banking sector to an all time low.

Bankers are now perceived to be on a par with criminals.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@caster rob wrote:

“Survival of the fittest went out with the cavemen Rob and it never worked. Silly!! “

If that were true we wouldn’t have evolved beyond cave-dwelling.

Now that’s silly.

If you think my education ahs “suffered” what’s your take on some of the pigin-English garbage posted above?

You’ve not proferred an opinion on that – strange.

Why should I castigate the quality of SPAG on a forum Rob. Given the ideology of some posters on here including yourself; Education should not be compulsory and only those with the desire should be educated.

[himoverthereParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

but if you dont want to borrow you dont have to. simple aint it. we all make choices and the terms are in front of you before you sign.

How many / what % of people do not have to borrow money in their lives? Perhaps a nation built on house ownership is not a good thing. Irrespective, financial institutions have a duty to manage OUR money sensibly and with little risk.

A previous poster said why does the person below not replace the one above. I cannot even believe he does know the answer. Those at the top block those below in part by simply holding the post but also for fear that person is better than they are. Nobody is irreplaceable.

100% of people do not HAVE to borrow but most choose to do so. as for your theory regarding the top bankers blocking the way for the rest you are wrong. my point is there are many bankers doing the same job and some are better than others. the better ones get the bigger bonus. (I know this for a fact as i have been there and done it). the reason they get the bigger bonus is directly linked to performance so why not pay the bonus to keep the best performing staff? you and i both know they as you would will leave for a bank that will give a bonus if they dont get one.

I do see your point about the bank lending over the amount that some one should borrow. but you have got to say its not just the banks fault as the customer should know their limits.

after all would you borrow more than you could afford?

I hope you realise how laughable it is as an ex banker to chastise Joe Public for how they spend their OWN MONEY when bankers so willfully and incredulously squandered JOE PUBLIC’S MONEY and then have the gaul to suggest they deserve bonuses.

One of the pro banker posters in their nanny state rhetoric post said should we protect people from themselves. Indeed we should but even more from bankers.

Every man / jack working in the banking sector should be thoroughly embarassed by the way their colleagues have mis managed OUR MONEY and plummeted the reputation of the banking sector to an all time low.

Bankers are now perceived to be on a par with criminals.

Are you for real? your trying to tell me its all the bankers fault. you seem to be of the opinion that if the bank will lend you it you will take it? You say you need protecting form bankers Yet you admit you need protection form your self. I for one am happy with every single thing i done working for the banks i worked for thats for sure. as for the bonuses i still stand by my views you should get a performance related bonus if you perform.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@himoverthere wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong but Joe public goes to a bank and when he/she borrows money they pay back far more than they borrowed. The more screwed they are then the more the banks screw them.

but if you dont want to borrow you dont have to. simple aint it. we all make choices and the terms are in front of you before you sign.

How many / what % of people do not have to borrow money in their lives? Perhaps a nation built on house ownership is not a good thing. Irrespective, financial institutions have a duty to manage OUR money sensibly and with little risk.

A previous poster said why does the person below not replace the one above. I cannot even believe he does know the answer. Those at the top block those below in part by simply holding the post but also for fear that person is better than they are. Nobody is irreplaceable.

100% of people do not HAVE to borrow but most choose to do so. as for your theory regarding the top bankers blocking the way for the rest you are wrong. my point is there are many bankers doing the same job and some are better than others. the better ones get the bigger bonus. (I know this for a fact as i have been there and done it). the reason they get the bigger bonus is directly linked to performance so why not pay the bonus to keep the best performing staff? you and i both know they as you would will leave for a bank that will give a bonus if they dont get one.

I do see your point about the bank lending over the amount that some one should borrow. but you have got to say its not just the banks fault as the customer should know their limits.

after all would you borrow more than you could afford?

I hope you realise how laughable it is as an ex banker to chastise Joe Public for how they spend their OWN MONEY when bankers so willfully and incredulously squandered JOE PUBLIC’S MONEY and then have the gaul to suggest they deserve bonuses.

One of the pro banker posters in their nanny state rhetoric post said should we protect people from themselves. Indeed we should but even more from bankers.

Every man / jack working in the banking sector should be thoroughly embarassed by the way their colleagues have mis managed OUR MONEY and plummeted the reputation of the banking sector to an all time low.

Bankers are now perceived to be on a par with criminals.

Are you for real? your trying to tell me its all the bankers fault. you seem to be of the opinion that if the bank will lend you it you will take it? You say you need protecting form bankers Yet you admit you need protection form your self. I for one am happy with every single thing i done working for the banks i worked for thats for sure. as for the bonuses i still stand by my views you should get a performance related bonus if you perform.

100% for real but you worry me greatly.

The way you suggest that banks and yourself were happy to operate is no better than loan sharks. Using your premise, loan sharks should be legalised. I am astonished you were allowed to work for a bank with your attitude or perhaps it explains why banks made so many atrocious decisions.

I was under the impression that banking operated under a code of ethics? hence why your friends the loan sharks are illegal and bank are legal.

Ethics, standards, decency are fundamental to all aspects have life. You seem bereft of such qualities.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

“Bankers are now perceived to be on a par with criminals.”

By left-wingers seeking alternative scapegoats.

“and then have the gaul to suggest they deserve bonuses.”

Seems my education didn’t suffer alone.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Ron is that the best you have to offer

[TF_herbie]

bonuses~think i work in the public domain. i am a servant of the people, a man who society cannot do without. i serve the rate/tax payers and in a small way save them money year on year. for this i recieve a wage, paid for by the people. now as i do save these people money by multi tasking above and beyond my post can one of you shysters sorry bank workers tell me why i do not get a work related bonus. i ask this question on behalf of the nurses, fire fighters ,dustmen, cleaning staff, hospital workers, emergency providers, non teaching staff, teachers, maintenance men. ~think ~think. after all chaps if its fair to pay the very people who have raped our nation a bonus , should not every worker in this country be treated the same.
as for lending money to people who will never be in a position to pay it back~think stupid is as stupid does. just dont see why as a tax payer i have to bail the stupid out and then reward them for it. they should have been allowed to fail. only the low paid and vunerable people in this not battered country are going to suffer, another 2,500 jobs gone in birmingham. ask each and every worker on £6 an hour who has to sign on this monday what he thinks about you shyster,s and your bonuses.

[TF_Jadstar70]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@Jadstar70 wrote:

Can those that are very “anti City banks”, do you know what these insitutions actually contribute to our economy on a % term basis? In relation to all other industries?

Would you rather they werent here and moved to India or Kuala Lumpa, or Germany for instance?

What effect do you think this would have on the country as a whole, and how would you propose the fiscal hole left by these financial institutions, leaving the UK to operate, would to be filled?~think ~think

Just curious…

Your point is?

We were told by our wonderful bankers that if we did not bail them out they would lose everything. We helped them and put ourselves in a huge mess that ordinary people are now paying for whilst the bankers take the P eextracting large profilts and ludicrous bonuses.

Whatever happened to a society where one good turn deserves another. From where I am standing it is akin to finding a mans wallet containing 10K, giving it to him and receiving 1p in return.

My “point is” , seeing as you are the self appointed font of all knowledge on all topics on this forum, can you answer the question?
If you are not aware of the answers to my question, and these facts and figures, I can hardly take your offered (and lengthy) uneducated opinions on this subject seriously now, can I, let alone debate with you?

If the banks that had been in trouble, been left to go bust, would the same people cited by herbie in the post above, still be losing their jobs? Would the deficit still be in the mess its in?
Same old same old, Labour spends a decade or so getting the countrys finances in a worse state than that of Viv Nicholsons’, for the Tories to make the hard decisions (and get the blame) for Labah to come back in and promise to give it all away again (and then some- what did they spend last term, for every £3 in revenue they spent £4?! If you want a lesson on stupid is stupid does herbie- there you have it!))
Your all very anti capitalist on here, which is extraodinary really, seeing as I know some of you are employed by the public sector, paid for by the private sector,which is mainly capitalist based!
Maybe all us capitalists should upsticks and get the hell out, would there be enough copies of the Guardian to keep you warm at night?

[TF_Jadstar70]

herbie wrote:

bonuses~think i work in the public domain. i am a servant of the people, a man who society cannot do without. i serve the rate/tax payers and in a small way save them money year on year. for this i recieve a wage, paid for by the people. now as i do save these people money by multi tasking above and beyond my post can one of you shysters sorry bank workers tell me why i do not get a work related bonus. i ask this question on behalf of the nurses, fire fighters ,dustmen, cleaning staff, hospital workers, emergency providers, non teaching staff, teachers, maintenance men. ~think ~think. after all chaps if its fair to pay the very people who have raped our nation a bonus , should not every worker in this country be treated the same.

At a guess to your opening question herbie, I would say its becuase like most sevice based public sector positions you dont actually generate any profit, and you ar paid by the people, earning money and paying taxes through people working for or in the ptivate sector.
So out of what “pot” would you like a bonus to be paid from please?
You see, service orientated public sector jobs, dont actually generate any money at all, despite what you think.
The trouble comes, when you have more public sector jobs and “industries” than you do private ones, a bit like the last few years really- you talk about irresponsibilty yet the last 13 years never happened to some of you?..odd.
Without these greedy bankers making all the money they do, and those nasty capitalists, what actually have we got?~think

[TF_fishcatcher4]

quote from jadstar,”maybe all us capitalists should up sticks and get the hell out.”
the arrogance of the capitalists is unbelievable.Depending on how far back you want to go in the greed is good times and lets privatise everything,you dont have to go back any further than the capitalists god THATCHER.Tell me any company that has been privatised that has benefited the customers( gas,water,electricity,steelworks,etc )not to mention the coal mines.Capitalism has brought this country to its knees and in the end will have done even more damage than THATCHER did.its only just beginning.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@Jadstar70 wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@Jadstar70 wrote:

Can those that are very “anti City banks”, do you know what these insitutions actually contribute to our economy on a % term basis? In relation to all other industries?

Would you rather they werent here and moved to India or Kuala Lumpa, or Germany for instance?

What effect do you think this would have on the country as a whole, and how would you propose the fiscal hole left by these financial institutions, leaving the UK to operate, would to be filled?~think ~think

Just curious…

Your point is?

We were told by our wonderful bankers that if we did not bail them out they would lose everything. We helped them and put ourselves in a huge mess that ordinary people are now paying for whilst the bankers take the P eextracting large profilts and ludicrous bonuses.

Whatever happened to a society where one good turn deserves another. From where I am standing it is akin to finding a mans wallet containing 10K, giving it to him and receiving 1p in return.

My “point is” , seeing as you are the self appointed font of all knowledge on all topics on this forum, can you answer the question?
If you are not aware of the answers to my question, and these facts and figures, I can hardly take your offered (and lengthy) uneducated opinions on this subject seriously now, can I, let alone debate with you?

If the banks that had been in trouble, been left to go bust, would the same people cited by herbie in the post above, still be losing their jobs? Would the deficit still be in the mess its in?
Same old same old, Labour spends a decade or so getting the countrys finances in a worse state than that of Viv Nicholsons’, for the Tories to make the hard decisions (and get the blame) for Labah to come back in and promise to give it all away again (and then some- what did they spend last term, for every £3 in revenue they spent £4?! If you want a lesson on stupid is stupid does herbie- there you have it!))
Your all very anti capitalist on here, which is extraodinary really, seeing as I know some of you are employed by the public sector, paid for by the private sector,which is mainly capitalist based!
Maybe all us capitalists should upsticks and get the hell out, would there be enough copies of the Guardian to keep you warm at night?

Why thanyou Jadstar. I am indeed passionate about society and the well being of one and all. I will never apologise for that. Nor should I. Indeed, surely this passion is the essence of debate and discussion.

First and foremost. Other than a couple of statement said in jest I.E stoning / criminals etc most of what I say is considered.

You will find nowhere have I advocated. Indeed you will find in older threads I supported supporting the banks. I supported the whole stimulus package. I firmly believe the regulators (politicians?) and banks got themselves and the whole country in a dire situation. The banks needed to be bailed out.

The issue I have is that in society, far too often help is given and the repayment simply does not reflect the assistance provided. Hence, I can empathise and understand why Herbie and many others now believe, they may have believed from the start but their number has grown that the banks should have been left to rot. It goes against what I believe so I cannot support it but I can empathise and understand it because the banks seem to have conveniently forgotten just how much they ruly owe the people of this country. The token gestures do not reflect what the banks truly owe and I would suggest the true debt to the country would mean not a single bonus would be paid for a decade / 20 years and that banks would be paying back above and beyond for the next 50 years / century.

In a progressive improving society it can never be an us and them scenario.

Likewise. People need to move away from this political allegiance nonsense. I was taught as a teenager that politicians are all the same irrespective of their party name / colors. I think since 1979 we have seen a new breed o

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

I will add more later. Busy now. Far too busy tomorrow.

[TF_lloydy1970]

To all you labour lovers, I ask you this:

In 1997 the country was in profit, our standard of living was better than ever and everything was rosy. This was after nearly 20 years of conservative rein.
After 13 years of labour giving our money to wasters and layabouts, we’re now billions in debt, have no gold reserve, kids come out of school with no discipline because of the nanny state. There were less and less apprenticeships because labour wanted everyone to go to college whether it would benefit them or not and the only people not affected by labours cock ups are the very rich or the very poor. From what I read on here it sounds like labour followers think people on the Dole should have the same standard of living as a person who has worked hard all their life to make things better for themselves. There are some extremely rich people in this world who stated with nothing, worked 7 days a week 52 weeks a year to get where they are, why should they pay for layabouts to sit on their parses watching Jeremy all day and playing on their x boxes. By the way I have been unemployed but I was out every day looking for work, I don’t own my own house and if I want something I have to save for it

[TF_fishcatcher4]

can i borrow your rose tinted specs lloydy.ask the steelworkers or miners or any of the privatised company employees who were sacked if everything was rosy.interest rates about 15% rising inflation,apprentice ships all but gone.No jobs for the young after the decimation of whole areas in my county of yorkshire.In my opinion yorkshire has never recovered from the vindictive spiteful attack by the THATCHER government.i wont even mention black wednesday.everything rosy,i dont think so.

[TF_Dodge]

Excellent post fishcatcher4 ~clap

Its the Armed Forces turn to be dismantled by David Thatcher this time around but hey his words ….” we can rely on our neighbour France to protect us “

I am really really scared !

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@fishcatcher4 wrote:

can i borrow your rose tinted specs lloydy.ask the steelworkers or miners or any of the privatised company employees who were sacked if everything was rosy.interest rates about 15% rising inflation,apprentice ships all but gone.No jobs for the young after the decimation of whole areas in my county of yorkshire.In my opinion yorkshire has never recovered from the vindictive spiteful attack by the THATCHER government.i wont even mention black wednesday.everything rosy,i dont think so.

Interest rates were 13% at the end of Callaghan’s catastrophe in 1979 so the relative increase was minimal.

Nevertheless, you must have been beside yourself with the 25% inflation under the 1975 Labour government:

http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/education/inflation/timeline/chart.htm

I believe your peacetime record still stands, surpassed only by the Napoleanic threat and the First World War, well done.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Worked in the car industry which was wrecked by union 1 man 1 job caveman idealistic views when you’re trying to compete in world market which happened when we signed to common market. Unions made workers idle and think the company were there for them instead of them being there to make company money.

I left school in 86 to a yts, I wish my kids had a yts to go on.

[TF_fishcatcher4]

Thanks caster rob for the info,didnt know how far back we were supposed to go.You didnt comment on the rest of the thread,so i take it you agree with me.~think

[TF_fishcatcher4]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

Worked in the car industry which was wrecked by union 1 man 1 job caveman idealistic views when you’re trying to compete in world market which happened when we signed to common market. Unions made workers idle and think the company were there for them instead of them being there to make company money.

I left school in 86 to a yts, I wish my kids had a yts to go on.

I remember the yts being introduced when my eldest daughter was ready to leave school.If memory serves school leavers were given £5 or £10 per week (by the government) and did about 3-6 months at whichever firm they were at.Most were then moved on somewhere else.The company paid nothing so they just used the scheme as free labour.Good old tory values of exploiting the working class.I told my daughter i would rather give her the money untill she got a real job,which she did.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Don’t know what year that was but in 86 it was £26 pound a week for first year in 2 year course, I worked hard and got took on full time at £1 an hour after first year, when my eldest left labour paid them £30 a week to go to college with no firm to take them on. I know which I prefer.

[TF_fishcatcher4]

Lloydy,the good companies did keep the youngsters on full time but there were loads who just went from one youngster to the next because it cost them nothing.That cant be right and nobody forced anybody to go to college but theres nothing wrong with wanting to learn as much as you can,surely this improves your chances of finding a job.

[TF_lloydy1970]

As there were good company’s and bad uns, there are kids who go to college to learn and some to doss and good bankers and bad bankers so on and so forth. That’s why no political party can win, labour try to live in an ideal world where everybody is equal but financially wreck the country and upset people and conservatives try to run the country as a viable business where people look after themselves instead of the welfare looking after them that upsets others. You then choose which you thinks right, it would be lovely if we could live in labours ideal world but in my eyes that would eventually lead to us becoming bankrupt, so I side with the Tories.

[woodhouse]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

As there were good company’s and bad uns, there are kids who go to college to learn and some to doss and good bankers and bad bankers so on and so forth. That’s why no political party can win, labour try to live in an ideal world where everybody is equal but financially wreck the country and upset people and conservatives try to run the country as a viable business where people look after themselves instead of the welfare looking after them that upsets others. You then choose which you thinks right, it would be lovely if we could live in labours ideal world but in my eyes that would eventually lead to us becoming bankrupt, so I side with the Tories.

That is a well thought out post Tina, can you now go and ask you husband if he can give me a lift in the morning?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Quality of life matters more than anything Lloydy

Do you actually think politicians are different besed on their party or are they all the same. I think the latter.

I do not believe in communism but by the same extreme I do not believe in the I am all right Jack sod the rest of you form of capitalism that some here seem to believe in.

[TF_DAT]

The problem with this country is that we have too much.Almost everyone on this forum will have income above and beyond what he needs to live a comfortable life.I look around my house and see x boxes,ps3s wiis sky tv etc etc and have to say what the cuff is it all about.All paid for all worked for,but if they went would it be the end of the world?
Does it matter what a banker gets,to me an average Joe.No matter what he gets my lot is to do 40 hours and have a weekend.If I am happy with what my firm pays me,am I unhappy because someone gets more?
To me one of the biggest wrongs in our country is that unlike most other developed nations we have tried to eradicate the peasent class.We tell every kid that a uni place is there for them even if emptying bins is all they are fit for and then we get migrants to empty the bins and the kids live out lives on the dole resenting the migrants who have “stole”there jobs.
As someone said earlier we flip flop from Labour to conservative,though what both of these parties stand for at the minute god only knows.
Don’t agree with Caster Rob or NWCA on everything they say but christ both would make a better prime minister than Cameron as they are honest and 100% believe in what they say

[TF_Fred Davis]

Mark wrote ” My day starts at 7:30 and ends at 6″

well all I can say is you lucky barsteward when I first started at the post office we started at 6 am and then because of the extremely low pay had to work overtime to 1030 pm thats right 6am to 10.30 pm each day to get a wage that most other folk were earning on a normal day.thank god pay did improve and the long hours vanished, but one week I can remember working 43 hours duty + 66 hours overtime and that was just to eek out a living and we still couldn’t afford holidays abroad, shares? most retired on ill health not surprisingly!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TF_fishcatcher4]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

As there were good company’s and bad uns, there are kids who go to college to learn and some to doss and good bankers and bad bankers so on and so forth. That’s why no political party can win, labour try to live in an ideal world where everybody is equal but financially wreck the country and upset people and conservatives try to run the country as a viable business where people look after themselves instead of the welfare looking after them that upsets others. You then choose which you thinks right, it would be lovely if we could live in labours ideal world but in my eyes that would eventually lead to us becoming bankrupt, so I side with the Tories.

Fair enough mate we will just have to agree to dissagree.tight lines.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

One can see why the desperately impoverished council in Manchester cannot afford to keep the toilets and libraries open:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1356183/Manchester-Council-closing-libraries-swimming-pools-public-toilets.html

I bet the council-tax payers there would much rather have a “Corporate Lead Officer, Gay Men’s issues” than a pot to p*ss in.

[TF_dirkdiggler]

the thing that really worries me rob is when the axe starts swinging these poeple are hardly likely to start with themselves are they?

[TF_caster robParticipant]

No they’re not.

That’s been proven before.

They just pass the savings on down to the front-line so that they have more political impact and the councils become more bureaucracy-laden.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Why are all conservative voters believed to be fans of Murdoch. I vote con and think Murdoch is a tw@t

[TF_piperpilot]

As usual the majority pay for the avaricious actions of the few corrupt and totally incompetent Politicos and Bankers, Vote for the Blues Yellows and Reds at your peril,

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

Why are all conservative voters believed to be fans of Murdoch. I vote con and think Murdoch is a tw@t

Good point Lloydy.

The fact that Murdoch supported Labour in 97 02 And 05 is another socialist history re-writing exercise.

I didn’t hear them squealing about him in those days.

[TF_herbie]

funny how the supporters of different parties seem to think the fault lies with mp,s of other parties, and parliment. they are one and the same tories,labour,libs, all to a man ruled by there paymasters the moneymen or if you like the banks.take the recent private members bill to curb loan sharks who can charge anything they like with examples of plus 5,000 %. these lenders target low paid workers who by definition are not the brightest in our society. one mp after another from both sides spoke in favour of a cap on interest rates although no figure was mentioned but it was a start , a way of removing the loan sharks from our streets. providence were the largest culprits knocking on the doors of the most vunerable letting them take out pay day loans at astronomical rates of interest knowing full well that in order to make the payments these people would have to take out even more loans.these people whilst we look down on them nowadays as the meme society would have us do need protecting from these shysters much like the europeans have done. so what did we get???? both leaders of the main parties voted against this bill on the grounds that they are at this time holding a revue. people who believe that need medical attention urgently, as there deluded and probably crackers. the real truth is the moneymen lobbied against any legislation with regards interest caps, a point many mp,s laboured on. why you ask should an elected parliment take the view that its better to allow these vunerable people to rot rather than upset the banks . the answer is very simple vunerable people dont pay your election fee,s neither do they give you massively paid jobs in the city. this is not about politics this is about a bunch of shysters raping and assett stripping this country, and asking the people to pay up and smile. the one big worry our glorious leaders are crapping themselves about is the fact that they can no longer control inflation because its coming from outside our shores. when the banks find there bottom line shrinking the bank of england will raise interest rates on the premise of controling inflation which by the way they have no control over. then the middle classes will be affected big time. lets see where camerons laughable big society gets us then.

[TF_wightangler]

Cameron’s ‘Big Society’ is marketing spin for stealth privatisation of the nhs and public services using proxy’s and ‘social enterprise’ public money as means for this process by larger institutional corporates- some of which the coalition cabinets 22 millionaires have indirect financial investment interest in and whose hedge fund share portfolio’s values will gain from in the longer privatisation process.

[TF_Gary]

Any of you heard the saying “if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em”? I moved to a bank 9 months ago and will earn double this year what I did in my old job (accountancy). The only quetions I ask myself are why did I leave it so long to join and why do more people not do the same?!

I am also intrigued by all of these comments about pitiful tax contributions by banks / bankers. I am staring down the barrel of an effective 71% marginal tax rate (tax + NI + student loan repayments). That means that for every £1 I earn, I only get to keep 29p. That does sometimes make me wonder why I put up with my standard day being 8am to midnight and working every weekend. I might as well go and get a job as a tube driver and get paid £43k a year for sitting on my arse, pushing a buttom and getting paid quadruple time on bank holidays with Bob Crow in my corner whinging about how hard done to I am. LOL!

[TF_Pikey]

Isn’t it funny how everyone thinks they work harder than everyone else.

We used to live in a paper bag in the middle of the road, had to get up an hour before we went to bed and for our first job, had to lick the road clean etc etc

[TF_wightangler]

blimey- that those few who can afford to pay higher tax rates are whingeing about poorer people is sadly not suprising- nor how hard working they are – the incentives to do so are considerable.How wonderful you are to be able to get private treatment= you really must be glad that the greedy and selfish Feckers who own this coalition are now using public money to privatise public services.
Some real ‘socially minded and aware individual on this thread has bemoaned the lack of a peasant class- must be a Mubarak fan – that’s all right then.
Why not bring back slavery or remove the minimum wage?- cameron’s has lots of family tips.

I must pont out a recent ‘cost- cutting’ rationalisation exercise by the corporate management of a private housing group that sacked it’s maintenance janitors on bare minimum wage,and invited them to apply for their old jobs back now under a different title with ‘maintenance operative’ added. The ‘lucky’ winners then got a nice pay cut of £3000 plus their overtime curtailed(including weekends). The group of senior management who thought up this ‘saving’wheeze did’nt however commensurately cut their own £100,000 plus wages however, and indeed were rewarded with a performance ‘bonus’ for 2010.
Strangely, enough- the paid board of mainly bankers which costs £1.1 million per annum plus travel & expense allowances- were also not affected by these 2009 causation economic rationalisation.
What’s even nicer is that the majority of their income and grants comes from social housing receipts including members of my feckless common peasant class- neighbours whom have just returned from Iraq and some serving in Afganistan as well as several prison officers with young families.
Robbing the poor majority and public purse to pay for the dividend and profits of the rich has never been so policy backed easy as this coalition proves.
Nice also that wage inequality medians are now near 1918 levels and that all economic indicators show a concurrent widening of health, education, opportunity and social and economic mobillity with horrendous consequences for young people.
That those doing well begrudge those less well off is further evidenced by charity giving and genuine community and voluntary contribution or involvement.
Still as long as you’re doing ok – we won’t think too hard about how this historically came about- just as long as i’m all right Jack and feck the rest!

[TF_Dodge]

Camerons “Big Society” ! Is this idiot for real ? The Police , essential services , councils etc etc are laying off workers left right and center through his barbaric cuts and guess what …..

Cameron wants the public to give up their spare time and do there jobs for free ! Bankers need not apply !

Any volunteers ?

[TF_caster robParticipant]

Ah yes, the “cuts”:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danielhannan/100075917/there-havent-been-any-net-public-spending-cuts-but-try-to-say-so-and-youll-be-howled-down-as-a-liar/

[TF_Dodge]

Telegraph journo and Tory MEP Daniel Hannan !

Wippee do !

[TF_caster robParticipant]

Meanwhile, at Labour’s own journal:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/mar/25/alistair-darling-cut-deeper-margaret-thatcher

At least Darling was honest about it, which is why Brown wanted him replaced with Balls.

[TF_Dodge]

Are you signing up for “The Big Society ” caster rob ? Unpaid policeman , street cleaner , social worker , coast guard etc etc …. or is your spare time too precious like everyone elses ? Its a tory thing apparently ~think

[TF_caster robParticipant]

Not me mate.

I think it’s boll0x.

The public-sector, especially the councils need a proper sort-out. I pay my taxes to have the bins emptied and the roads maintained. I don’t need my council to enlighten me on racial integration, climate change, diversity or dietary matters. I’m sure they could all save enough money by desisting from these activities and keep the libraries and bogs open instead.

[TF_Jadstar70]

@caster rob wrote:

Not me mate.

I think it’s boll0x.

The public-sector, especially the councils need a proper sort-out. I pay my taxes to have the bins emptied and the roads maintained. I don’t need my council to enlighten me on racial integration, climate change, diversity or dietary matters. I’m sure they could all save enough money by desisting from these activities and keep the libraries and bogs open instead.

~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@Gary wrote:

Any of you heard the saying “if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em”? I moved to a bank 9 months ago and will earn double this year what I did in my old job (accountancy). The only quetions I ask myself are why did I leave it so long to join and why do more people not do the same?!

I am also intrigued by all of these comments about pitiful tax contributions by banks / bankers. I am staring down the barrel of an effective 71% marginal tax rate (tax + NI + student loan repayments). That means that for every £1 I earn, I only get to keep 29p. That does sometimes make me wonder why I put up with my standard day being 8am to midnight and working every weekend. I might as well go and get a job as a tube driver and get paid £43k a year for sitting on my arse, pushing a buttom and getting paid quadruple time on bank holidays with Bob Crow in my corner whinging about how hard done to I am. LOL!

~naughty Gary and Caster Rob’s selfish attitude shared by many is a fundamental factor in why Britain has regressed.

Hand your resignation Gary. Plenty of people to take your place and they will do the job as well maybe better

[TF_piperpilot]

Nice profit by Barclays then,

[bigroachParticipant]

Yeah great profit by Barclays while our servicemen get laid off. Must be ace being over in afgan then told your getting laid off when you get home.

So before the banks nearly went bust we was 850 million In debt, it was the banks own fault lending to people who couldn’t afford it. So why all the cuts when if the government grew a pair and demanded it all back plus interest.850sounds a lot better than 1.7 trillion. Just out of interest does anyone know how much these wars cost?

[TF_Gary]

Someone mentioned the word incentives, which is precisely what I am getting at. Without preaching Marxist ideals of ‘from each according to his ability, to each according to his need’, surely tax and spending structures should be established to create incentives to work?

It is alright saying those who earn more should pay more – I think most people think this is reasonable. The problem is, what happens if those people choose to work less to reduce their income (and hence mitigate their tax liabilities) rather than just stumping up? This is what I was getting at when I said that I may as well take a job as a tube driver. I may earn less, but if 71% of it goes to the government anyway, I may as well work less hours and have an easier life.

To get us out of this mess, we need to encourage people to work more, not work less. That applies right throughout the income spectrum, particularly the wealth creators in the private sector.

NWCA said: “Hand your resignation Gary. Plenty of people to take your place and they will do the job as well maybe better”

With all due respect, I very much doubt it. If there were more people queuing up to take my place, people in the banking sector would get paid significantly less than they do. It is called supply and demand and was the main thrust of my original “if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em” argument. It beggars belief that more people do not seek jobs in the financial sector, pushing down wages for all involved. By taking some kind of perverse moral high ground relating to banks and the banking sector, you are actually grossly exacerbating the problem….

[bigroachParticipant]

Can those that are very “anti City banks”, do you know what these insitutions actually contribute to our economy on a % term basis? In relation to all other industries?

dont get me wrong i dont much about the banks, but yeah they gave us 850 million debt, right or wrong?

[TF_Gary]

Just to lay out some facts, did you know that the UK government will (in high probability) PROFIT from their stakes in RBS and Lloyds? Northern Rock will yield a relatively small loss for the taxpayer, but they do not and never have paid competitively (or what The Mirror would refer to as ‘obscene bonuses’ or some similar emotive garbage). This should put into perspective comments about the banks needing to pay back what they owe.

[TF_MICK THE BOOKIE]

I`ve got £3.40 in Barclays,which was transferred from my old Woolwich(spelling?) savings account.I have been trying to get it off them for 3 years….Bloody sheisters…That £3.40 is part of their massive profit…lol.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Why when its mentioned that labour were going to make these cuts do their supporters change the subject. Also why do suppoerters of labour who are so against the rich think its great when their football team spend billions and pay players over £200,000 a week when eventually the tickets that the working class man walking through the gates will increase significantly. More industry was closed under Blair hthan Thatcher but because all the strike and publicity didn’t surround it it all went un noticed.

[TF_Dodge]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

Why when its mentioned that labour were going to make these cuts do their supporters change the subject. Also why do suppoerters of labour who are so against the rich think its great when their football team spend billions and pay players over £200,000 a week when eventually the tickets that the working class man walking through the gates will increase significantly. More industry was closed under Blair hthan Thatcher but because all the strike and publicity didn’t surround it it all went un noticed.

Man City is probably has the cheapest season tickets in the premiership Dave and unlike Man Utd across the road (proper skint!) they dont have access or take money from your bank account even if you dont go to the game ! Anyway what has football got to do with this thread ? ~think Are you up for this “Big Society ” bollox or are you going fishing like the rest of us ! Wolverhampton does need some investment i have seen it ….. dont think your gonna get much help off Cameron and Osbourne though mate ~hand

[TF_lloydy1970]

That’s a pint I owe Woodhouse, he said you’d bite.

1 question.
1979 after labour
1997 after cons
2010 after labour

Out of the 3 which departing party left the country in the best shape.

Sorry Dodge you know I can’t help it, I love you really.

[TF_Dodge]

Deffo 2010 Dave ……

Much better shape than you are in anyway ! ROLMFBO x

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

Why when its mentioned that labour were going to make these cuts do their supporters change the subject. Also why do suppoerters of labour who are so against the rich think its great when their football team spend billions and pay players over £200,000 a week when eventually the tickets that the working class man walking through the gates will increase significantly. More industry was closed under Blair hthan Thatcher but because all the strike and publicity didn’t surround it it all went un noticed.

Lloydy NOBODY I have ever read has disputed the deficit would have to be reduced and cuts made. Labour openly admitted that.

The disagreement is on how quicky and how and when the deficit would be reduced.

You seem to be rewriting recent and past history.

Since 1979 we have been served by politicians irrespective of party who have actively encouraged and allowed the gap in wealth between people to widen. No politician did so with the speed / extent of Thatcher.

Since 1979 our wealth / assets have been wasted. Nobody wasted more than Thatcher.

1979 marks the date when so many British people allowed themselves to be so selfish and gullible that politicians of all parties have played a political game that has seen seen our country suffer.

Ultimately, we have only ourselves to blame because Gary and Rob are not unusual indeed they are probably the norm of selfish generations who short sighted greed is greed as long as I am okay I do not care what happens to anybody else culture prevailed.

Thatcher and all thereafter have duped so many. Many who claim or think they are intelligent. Conned by greed, something conmen/ women have utilised since time began.

[TF_lloydy1970]

We have become a nation that wants everything and want it yesterday. When I got married I bought a second hand 3 piece suit and scrimpt and saved to buy bits and bobs to make a home. Now everything has to be new and the house has to be perfect when they move in not built up over a period of time, and if they can’t afford it they go into debt for it.

As for cuts, they shouldn’t be looking at police, education and alike, they should start with the made up jobs that labour invented, the secretary to the secretary to the secretary of the lavatory inspector.
When poll tax 1st came in I thought it was a good idea, why should a pensioner living on own pay same tax as 6 adults in 1 house, but I lived in a labour run council area and did they give us a kicking. The labour areas put the highest rates up to score points and make cons look bad, I’m not saying cons wouldn’t have done the same but labour are supposed to be the party of the people.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Its seems to me in labour followed eyes that every problem between 1997 and 2010 is Thatcher’s fault and everything from 2010 to now is Cameron’s fault lmao

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

Its seems to me in labour followed eyes that every problem between 1997 and 2010 is Thatcher’s fault and everything from 2010 to now is Cameron’s fault lmao

You totally miss the point Lloydy and want to turn this into a political party bitch fest.

In many respects it is about what the ‘British people’ allow to happen to themselves / to their country/countries.

So much has been wasted and whether you like it or not Thatcher was the start of a whole new era. However, you can probably and should go further back to even the 1960’s and I guess the utterly bizarre 1970’s created the seeds for a Thatcher to emerge. Thereafter whatever they like to think or claim there was little or no difference between all the two political parties at the top.

We have been incredibly badly served by our politicians but we got what we deserved and ‘Gary’ is the end result. Quite sad really.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Sorry nwca, I was only born in 1970 so anything pre- Thatcher I can’t remember. I couldn’t stand Tony Blair, in my eyes from the time he became pm he was thinking about his future in Europe and I felt sorry for brown as he never had what it took and Blair knew it. I understand the hatred of Thatcher by miners and steel workers and if that’s the community I had lived in I would probably feel the same. I’m a bit young to really remember the miner strikes so don’t comment.

[TF_JohnC]

Dodge wrote:

Man City is probably has the cheapest season tickets in the premiership Dave and unlike Man Utd across the road (proper skint!)(Dodge=quote)

Well, thats aload of tripe, as usual!

Man City charge £420 – £515 and they’ve only recently started to fill it so it won’t be long before the prices rise.

Man Utd charge £513 – £931 and at least you get some trophies thrown in for that………

[TF_Dodge]

@JohnC wrote:

@Dodge wrote:

Man City is probably has the cheapest season tickets in the premiership Dave and unlike Man Utd across the road (proper skint!)(Dodge=quote)

Well, thats aload of tripe, as usual!

Man City charge £420 – £515 and they’ve only recently started to fill it so it won’t be long before the prices rise.

Man Utd charge £513 – £931 and at least you get some trophies thrown in for that………

Bet your one of them jumped up bankers ?

Did i spell banker right ~think

[TF_Gary]

NWCA, you are misrepresenting fundamental concepts of a strong society such as hard work, social mobility, incentive structures and personal responsibility as ‘greed’. And even worse than that, you are blaming it on politicians. This epitomises the inverse of the concepts that I have detailed above, whereby everyone looks first to the State to provide for them and second to themselves.

I find it profoundly disappointing that people do not seek to do the best that they can for themselves and their families. Putting aside any emotive attachment to ‘bankers’ for a second, in my opinion, turning down a job working slightly harder, but doing more interesting work and getting paid more money is moronic. Why would anyone do this without good reason? Is it because they think they are serving some greater good and claiming the moral high ground? This view point would be laughable if it were not so tragic.

Also, if there were more ‘Garys’, paying more in to the system than they take out, we would not be in the fiscal crisis that we find ourselves in….

[TF_JohnC]

(Dodge=quote) Bet your one of them jumped up bankers ?

Did i spell banker right ~think (Dodge=quote)

No, not a jumped up “banker”, just stating the facts. Which you seem to ignored?……

[TF_Dodge]

@JohnC wrote:

(Dodge=quote) Bet your one of them jumped up bankers ?

Did i spell banker right ~think (Dodge=quote)

No, not a jumped up “banker”, just stating the facts. Which you seem to ignored?……

The thread is about bankers ?

Your point being ?

[TF_herbie]

so outside influences such as wheat, oil, gas, heating oil tax rises. are responsable for 4% inflation which are totally out of the people of this country.s control. can one of you overpaid shysters tell me why the banks are lobbying so hard for an interest rise to curb inflation~think you know the inflation out of our control. an interest rise puts money into who,s pockets~think ~think ~think ah ha it goes into the banks pockets so they can not only raise there salary,s by 39% whilst i get 0% but pay a bonus as well, which i dont get. christ boys you cannot lose. hats off to the banks , just when you thought you,d been screwed to death they come up with another gimmick to screw you even more. cant help feeling abused somehow.

[himoverthereParticipant]

@herbie wrote:

so outside influences such as wheat, oil, gas, heating oil tax rises. are responsable for 4% inflation which are totally out of the people of this country.s control. can one of you overpaid shysters tell me why the banks are lobbying so hard for an interest rise to curb inflation~think you know the inflation out of our control. an interest rise puts money into who,s pockets~think ~think ~think ah ha it goes into the banks pockets so they can not only raise there salary,s by 39% whilst i get 0% but pay a bonus as well, which i dont get. christ boys you cannot lose. hats off to the banks , just when you thought you,d been screwed to death they come up with another gimmick to screw you even more. cant help feeling abused somehow.

Try joining it beats being so bitter.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@ herbie

“so outside influences such as wheat, oil, gas, heating oil tax rises. are responsable for 4% inflation which are totally out of the people of this country.s control.”

You failed to include Gordon’s little stint on his John Bull printing press in your list.

Everywhere QE has been tried roaring inflation has inevitably followed, even hyper in the case of Weimar and Mugabeland.

Strange economic model to follow……………………………………………………………………………………………………………..

[TF_wightangler]

Well, well ,well the chinese govt. has just announced an increase in their banks liquidy reserves to be held because of inflationary pressures.
Whilst- some of this is a response to threats of a trade -import tarriff prospect threatened by the US in part to get the chinese to raise the value of their currency- nevertheless it shows a pragmatic wider use of regulation to ease overheating without being solely dependant on interest rates and that bank regulation & required liquidty reserves are a wider national economic intrument than the complete lack of any enforcement or increase in the nominal 8% that prize prick Osborn relies on to keep the city favourable – given that lack of liquidity & regulation was ,with overvalueing a prime causation of the 2009 crisis- but that a concerted campaign by babkers to keep unchanged structurally and unchecked in specul;ation and a wider use of hedge fund for short term profit that makes bonuses and further entrenches by increased reliance and size the use of bundled collateralised debt as the main source of ‘growth’. Commonsense tells us that the housing bubble at expense of the wider economy would mean an increase in the size of overvalued property mortgages but like the bonus culture as a lot of people get commissions no one rocks the boat. that gone- speculation is still rampant and bonus %’s have still disregarded the wage restraint of the average worker. indeed, since wages excluding higher execs linked to casino investment which include HA’s and LA were relatively in line with inflation pre-2009- the growth was in borrowing for property aquisition at inflated prices- thus rubbishing the arrogant and up their own arses banking accoylytes who see only their own short term interest and get paid to because of the massive structural economic distortion compared to the manufacturing and engineering sectors which again were disadvantaged in investment terms whilst the chinese state backed commercial manufacturing chinese sector.
That germany & france, holland escaped the worst of the bubble crash is still due to their diversification and that still only about 40& of their citizens choose not to play the banks game with emphasis and commissions on motrgages and assoc. financial products.
That arrogant feckers can state they work harder than health workers and state service, care workers and commercial tradesman and retail sector who have to deal with real people for far less reward -shows how far this distortion of wealth and consequence has become. There will be a reckoning, trouble is the regulated and more integrated economies with equity reserves that can be uised for longer term inward investment and support of export will be those that survive the next time that ‘confidence’ and pass the parcel occurs!

[TF_MICK THE BOOKIE]

Jesus Adrian….Who rattled your chain?.That is some post pal.I think Herbie should be strung up by his testicles and whipped with a legnth of Black Hydro by PTB on his visit to Stafford Moor for starting this thread.What a blinder….It certainly caused the baying mob to get their veiws posted.
Fair play to you Herb……Have a nice day now.~think ~think ~think ~clap ~clap ~clap

[TF_Gary]

“That arrogant feckers can state they work harder than health workers and state service, care workers and commercial tradesman and retail sector who have to deal with real people for far less reward -shows how far this distortion of wealth and consequence has become.”

Last time I checked, no-one was forced to be a health worker, civil servant, care worker, commercial tradesman or work in the retail sector. This is not to deny that nurses, care workers etc are not valued – I could not do the job that they do (well, I probably COULD, but I would not WANT to). But people know the relative merits of these careers before embarking on them and pursue their career choices accordingly.

Also, I’m intrigued that you think that bankers don’t real with ‘real people’. I am sure that there are some that don’t, just like there are retail staff who hide in a warehouse all day and pen-pushing civil servants who have never done an honest day’s work in their life. Who do you think my clients are that pay the fees that ultimately pay the bills? Martians or other extra terrestrial creatures? Get real.

And if you think the Chinese are bastians of sensible economic policy, check out their banks’ lending record through the crisis. And look at what their inflation rate is. And check out the average income per capita in China. And see how many state sponsored white elephants are being built to keep construction workers in jobs. And have a look at the multiple of house prices to average earnings in the big cities. I think that you need to be VERY careful before holding up China as a good example for anything, other than current economic growth (primarily based on a massive number of people and starting from a low base). A lot of people who know more about China than you or I are starting to conclude that it is just another bubble.

Also, intrigued by your examples of countries that ‘escaped the worst of the crisis’. Do you know ANYTHING about the Dutch banking sector? Have you heard of ABN-AMRO and Fortis? And no-one was saying what a terrible thing home-ownership was when house prices were increassing at 20% per year and people were using the equity to buy new cars, go on holidays, etc.

Just to conclude, I would like to say that all people from the Isle of Wight are narcicisstic parochialist morons with no comprehension of what is happening in the real world. See, it doesn’t just work with bankers – we can all throw around broad-brush unsubstantiated insults…

[TF_Dodge]

Classic thread herbie ….. well done me old mate ~clap ~clap

This thread highlights how certain people in our society feel so so more important than any one else through claiming that they work harder and are better at whatever they do than anyone else in life, driven by greed and selfishness …… how far up their own arses are they ?

Thatchers children eh …… dont you just luv em ! NOT ! ~naughty ~naughty

[TF_caster robParticipant]

Yes, excellent thread herbie.

It certainly highlights how certain people in society can only throw around jibes and accusations but cannot answer salient points.

Thatcher’s children…………………………………………………………. don’t you just wish they’d take some of the fat profits they made from buying their grotty council houses on the cheap and start ploughing it into the big society like anyone with a sense of community should?

Gary, thanks for contributing some facts mate, I hope they read it at the Town Halls.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Barclays has revealed it paid £113m in corporation tax to the UK in 2009, only 2.4% of its £4.85bn annual profit.

It is FACTS like this that show just what is wrong with this country. I will post more when I have time.

A child of 1970 who saw the light as his family / community experienced the Miners Strike / the decline of manufacturing in the U.K

Gary and Rob you are a product of the Thatcher and post Thatcher politics but equally society pre Thatcher is as much to blame.

[tunnel topper]

everyone seams to criticise queen maggies reign as P.M,. no one more than me. but every government since has basically followed her lead or built up on it.
cameron is appearing to turn things around eg. giving power back to local gvt. cutting red tape and the need to prove where every penny has gone.
the main thing that has not changed is that public services should be paid for at the point of use, why should childless people pay for schools. healthy people with healthy life styles pay for medical care for fat people…. and so on. these are excuses!
the main thing is that we are paying far too little in income tax to provide the services that we all are shouting for.
when it comes to voting we keep following the party that promises to cut tax, it is time we changed and demanded our m.p’s provide the services we deserve never mind want.
a selfish society can never be a good one.
i don’t care which party gets in as long as they look after the people ie. you and me.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@NWCA:

“Barclays has revealed it paid £113m in corporation tax to the UK in 2009, only 2.4% of its £4.85bn annual profit.”

Good for them, I wish I only paid 2.4% tax. They’ve done nothing illegal and were sensible enough to refuse Gordon the Saviours advances when he broke his own monopolies law and encouraged the likes of Lloyds to buy out other banks and saddle themselves with new debts.

“Gary and Rob you are a product of the Thatcher and post Thatcher politics but equally society pre Thatcher is as much to blame.”

Blame?

You make us sound like criminals for holding a contrary opinion to yours, or is that school teacher syndrome of treating individuals as belittled children?

I could just as easily say that you are a product of the nannying welfare state it’s to “blame” for people like you.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Still no answer to which leaving party left us in the best state. I thinks too many people only want to see what they want to see.
I think the government should give us all a million each so we don’t have to work, the banks ask everyone to pay the money they owe back then shut all the banks and people like Barry hearn should stop all their money making ventures

[TF_lloydy1970]

Think I might tell my kids to have as many kids before they’re 20 and rake it in.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Lloydy your question is not really a sensible one. 1). What is the best state, to some it is one thing to another it is something else. But 2) Crucially you are not comparing like with like. 3. You often deal with things beyond your control

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@caster rob wrote:

@NWCA:

“Barclays has revealed it paid £113m in corporation tax to the UK in 2009, only 2.4% of its £4.85bn annual profit.”

Good for them, I wish I only paid 2.4% tax. They’ve done nothing illegal and were sensible enough to refuse Gordon the Saviours advances when he broke his own monopolies law and encouraged the likes of Lloyds to buy out other banks and saddle themselves with new debts.

“Gary and Rob you are a product of the Thatcher and post Thatcher politics but equally society pre Thatcher is as much to blame.”

Blame?

You make us sound like criminals for holding a contrary opinion to yours, or is that school teacher syndrome of treating individuals as belittled children?

I could just as easily say that you are a product of the nannying welfare state it’s to “blame” for people like you.

Nowhere did I say they were acting illegally but I decided to throw a fact spanner in your ploy and the big question is it is right morally that Joe Public should suffer whilst EVERY financial institution reaped the benefit of Government policy. Therein lies the problem with your narrow view.

Bad debt is a huge factor in banking. Every bank not just those that received direct hand outs benefitted from a Government policy that kept the country afloat and minimised the impact of bad debt. Whether or not they were right to do that is now irrelevant. They did. What matters now is how we regain a more solvent position for the nation. Personally, I would argue that it is now time for the bankers to pay back what they morally owe the country not what they legally get away with. Morally it is abhorrent that Joe Public are fearing for their very livelihood / futures whilst fat cat bankers waive two fingers in the air in a ‘let them eat cake’ response.

I find yours and Gary’s attitude so incredibly sad. You are bereft of compassion for your fellow man. You could not give a damn. We / Society does not exist it is I, I, I to hell with everybody else.

I once suggested you should watch a documentary to educate yourself and learn what happens when society becomes far too selfish. Riots / civil unrest erupted just as they are now in the Middle East. Perhaps it is time British people rose together and demanded change. A better way of living.

I find lazy people happy to rely on the state abhorrent but I find selfishness of immoral institutions / individuals equally abhorrent. Sadly, neither yourself Rob or Gary are any better than the benefit scroungers you so despise. You were both a product of a society that went so badly wrong irrespective of who was running the country.

Why should ordinary people / society suffer because politicians of all parties / financial institutions acted so stupidly and irresponsibly.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Not sensible, was taking thread serious ,not now.
1979 country on knees
1997 country prosperous
2010 country worse than 1979.

Any arguments welcome

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@NWCA:

“and the big question is it is right morally that Joe Public should suffer whilst EVERY financial institution reaped the benefit of Government policy. Therein lies the problem with your narrow view.”

I’d ask: is it right morally that private Joe Public should suffer while public-funded Joe Public reaped the benefit of Government policy? Another narrow view, dont you think?

“Personally, I would argue that it is now time for the bankers to pay back what they morally owe the country not what they legally get away with. Morally it is abhorrent that Joe Public are fearing for their very livelihood / futures whilst fat cat bankers waive two fingers in the air in a ‘let them eat cake’ response.”

Personally, I would argue that it is now time for the local government officers to pay back the country what they morally owe.

http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/229334/Cap-on-council-salaries

Is organising a bin-emptying round so demanding?

“I find yours and Gary’s attitude so incredibly sad. You are bereft of compassion for your fellow man. You could not give a damn. We / Society does not exist it is I, I, I to hell with everybody else.”

Yeah, I had an unfortunate encounter with society once, full of wasters, winoes, druggies and human-flotsam. I was the only financial contributor, the rest of them just took.

“I once suggested you should watch a documentary to educate yourself and learn what happens when society becomes far too selfish. Riots / civil unrest erupted just as they are now in the Middle East. Perhaps it is time British people rose together and demanded change. A better way of living.”

Wrong.

You didn’t suggest, you TOLD me to watch it – which is why I’d have walked across hot coals rather than submit to your edict. Selective amnesia or school teacher autonomy prevalent here.

“Sadly, neither yourself Rob or Gary are any better than the benefit scroungers you so despise.”

Nice of you to assume the mantle of arbitrator on these matters. We are truely blessed, it’s almost divine.

“Why should ordinary people / society suffer because politicians of all parties / financial institutions acted so stupidly and irresponsibly.”

Wasn’t all of them.

Just down to Gordon “no more boom & bust” and his FSA.

[TF_wightangler]

err totally wrong Caster Rob,
there was a far bigger deficit for obvious reasons in 1945- despite this genuine desire for a better life for ALL and their children by those who had fought the war for us and their belief , lead to investment in infrastructure in public spending that lead to the formation of the NHS & the welfare state.
This tory led coalition of greed and profit for the few and their cronies- have made the common people PAY for a bloated and unregulated banking sectors debt and narrow mistakes by avoidance of regulation- Paying off the debt is findamentally about making sure the UK has sufficient budget reserve to be able to ‘survive’ another financial confidence credit crunch so as to be able to again ‘support’ the banks and a speculators attack on the pound and bonds linked to the fs banks. Without regulation and a raising of the UK banking equity % this is inevitable as many economic writers now suggest and will again require the country to pay for banking’s unchanged structure and now entrenched bonus culture.
This is robbery of the very richest from the majority of UK citizens coupled with an attempt by the criminal tory scum to make a profit for their private corporate cronies and own private trust and hedge fund investments out of the public sector and services which people gave up their lives and have paid for for a few rich scum using offshore accounts to avoid any personal liabillity.
It will lead to real class war and unrest simular to the democratic changes going on in ME since fundamentally our public state is under threat from the same narrow forces of corruption and avarice!

[TF_Gary]

Do you know WHY Barclays paid so little corporation tax? It is (partly) because they were carrying forward losses sustained in prior years. On this very forum, I previously advocated an amnesty on losses sustained during the crisis. Has anyone else suggested any practical alternative means of the banks “paying what they owe”?

I think there are two points here. One is an ideological point about the reach of the state. One view seems to be that first and foremost we should depend on the state and everyone should make decisions based on the ‘collective good’ of society. The alternative (my view) is that we should allow individual freedoms, with the state’s role being to ensure that individual interests are consistent with the wider interest of ‘society’. I won’t go into this as it justifies more than what I have time to write here. And I don’t think anyone would ever agree!

The other point is about how to deal with banks and other systemically risky institutions, such that the government does not have to bail out ANY sector (not just banks – look at the US automakers) again. I totally agree that taxes on institutions that are systemically risky should be higher. I have a massive issue with the implicit guarantee that large banks benefit from. Ask my mate who works at Barclays who I rib endlessly on this very topic. The problem is, I just don’t think people have a clue about the meaning of ‘systemic risk’. Businesses that are profitable and staff that are well remunerated do not correlate directly to high systemic risk. Rather than addressing systemic risk, the reaction of the populus is focused on “bashing bankers”, given that they are, in my opinion, envious of their success and sceptical of their earning power.

To elaborate briefly on those two points:
1) As a nation, we like to belittle success. Kids at school get bullied if they are top of the class. There are genuine social constructs that support failure. On sports days, kids get medals for participating, not winning. Achievement and success is, quite frankly, discouraged.

2) Any businesss or activity that is not widely understood, and banking (broadly defined) fits in here, is regarded with deep suspicion. The fact that any of these activities could be immensely profitable is unfathomable to the average joe who earns £6 an hour in a factory or £30k a year teaching kids how to be failures.

Any business that is successful, ergo, must be robbing people or otherwise deceiving somebody somewhere down the line. What people don’t realise is that some services are just higher value added than others; hence why, as an example, footballers get paid more than nurses. Banks, particularly those involved in corporate finance services, generate significant added value for sophisticated clients. As such, clients will pay a premium for those services and hence staff of those organisations earn premium remuneration.

The other side of the remuneration equation is that there is a fairly limited pool of individuals with the necessary skills to operate in the sector. If more people moved in to banking and developed those skills remuneration would come down. How ironic, therefore, that people claiming moral high ground of not wanting to go near banking and abusing bankers as scum are actually reinforcing the mechanism that allows for their preimum remuneration? Cheers NWCA, keep up the good work!

I have not got involved with the politics of this situation because I have given up on it – whoever is in power, we will have to pay more tax – FACT.

One concluding remark, as the saying goes, “those who can, do; those who can’t… teach”.

[TF_herbie]

very nicely spun gary. question is and always will be. if the banks and there workers are so dam good why did the country/people have to bail them out to the tune of 850 billion. what right did they have to be bailed out??. why should i have to lay off 6 workers as a consequence of this misuse of public funds.add to that the services they pay for are to be reduced by an estimated 30%.on top of this as a bonus there pay is to be frozen for 3 years or to put it another way there living standards will drop by 10%.
if they own there own house they will have in the next months haveto find more money to pay the banks as interest rates rise. this is needed to protect us from inflation????? . not quite sure how someone losing there low paid job and having to pay even more money to the banks affects the cost of oil/gas/vat rises/rail fares, but he o maybe when the foreign investers see joe public giving yet more money to the bankers they will step in and reduce the cost of a barrel of brent crude and therefore lower inflation. one thing is very clear to me gary.your proffesion is now seen as the lowest form of life. in a recent pole amongst bank workers 72% tell people they work elsewhere, sums it up .

[TF_Gary]

Herbie, I have been wondering where you got your £850bn figure from. Is it the same £850bn figure as described here:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/163850bn-official-cost-of-the-bank-bailout-1833830.html

To quote the article (I have added the numbering):

“The commitments include:
1) buying £76bn of shares in Royal Bank of Scotland and the Lloyds Banking Group;
2) indemnifying the Bank of England against losses incurred in providing more than £200bn of liquidity support;
3) guaranteeing up to £250bn of wholesale borrowing by banks to strengthen liquidity;
4) providing £40bn of loans and other funding to Bradford & Bingley and the Financial Services Compensation Scheme;
5) insurance cover of over £280bn for bank assets.”

If so, I am more than happy to explain a little more to you about each of these schemes and hence why £850bn does not reflect the true cost to taxpayers of the bailout.

Second, What right does the public sector have to be ‘bailed out’ to the tune of £180bn this year, £180bn last year, £150bn next year and so on? In fact, what right does the public sector have to burden me and the rest of the future of this country with billions of pounds of debt every single year? Every sector needs to be self-sufficient in the long term, whether it is retail, construction, financial services or governement.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

I make no apology for attacking spivs and gamblers who did more harm to the British economy than Bob Crow [the RMT union leader] could achieve in his wildest Trotskyite fantasies, while paying themselves outrageous bonuses underwritten by the taxpayer

[TF_Dodge]

@caster rob wrote:

One can see why the desperately impoverished council in Manchester cannot afford to keep the toilets and libraries open:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1356183/Manchester-Council-closing-libraries-swimming-pools-public-toilets.html

I bet the council-tax payers there would much rather have a “Corporate Lead Officer, Gay Men’s issues” than a pot to p*ss in.

Oooooops missed this Tory propaganda bollox !

Oh how the tories would love to get their hands on the capital of the north super rich , super modern , super trendy MANCHESTER ! They wont and never will as it is Labour heartland and always will be. Oh and the PINK pound ….. it has made fortunes for Manchester ! Daily Mail must sell at least 50 odd copies up here every day ~sick

[TF_eels]

Second, What right does the public sector have to be ‘bailed out’ to the tune of £180bn this year, £180bn last year, £150bn next year and so on? In fact, what right does the public sector have to burden me and the rest of the future of this country with billions of pounds of debt every single year? Every sector needs to be self-sufficient in the long term, whether it is retail, construction, financial services or governement. ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@eels wrote:

Second, What right does the public sector have to be ‘bailed out’ to the tune of £180bn this year, £180bn last year, £150bn next year and so on? In fact, what right does the public sector have to burden me and the rest of the future of this country with billions of pounds of debt every single year? Every sector needs to be self-sufficient in the long term, whether it is retail, construction, financial services or governement. ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap

Eels, do you not think it is an oxymoron that a member of the banking sector made that statement?

Strikes me most people have no idea what the public sector is or how vital it has been/is in their lives. I blame the teachers personally.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

“Strikes me most people have no idea what the public sector is or how vital it has been/is in their lives.”

I’m fairly confident that the interference and petty bureaucracy would be much-missed if it wasn’t there.

[TF_eels]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@eels wrote:

Second, What right does the public sector have to be ‘bailed out’ to the tune of £180bn this year, £180bn last year, £150bn next year and so on? In fact, what right does the public sector have to burden me and the rest of the future of this country with billions of pounds of debt every single year? Every sector needs to be self-sufficient in the long term, whether it is retail, construction, financial services or governement. ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap

Eels, do you not think it is an oxymoron that a member of the banking sector made that statement?

Strikes me most people have no idea what the public sector is or how vital it has been/is in their lives. I blame the teachers personally.

No i don’t think it’s an oxymoron.

What i do find strange is that every one wants to blaim only the bankers.I would of thought the fact the previous government were spending £4 for every £3 that came in to the coffers might also have some thing to do with our current situation??

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Without the public sector Rob you would not enjoy the life you do. Neither would Gary

Quote:

4th October, 2010 that Chancellor George Osborne said: “We will not allow money to flow unimpeded out of those banks into huge bonuses, if that means money is not flowing out in credit to the small businesses who did nothing to cause this crash and suffered most in itâ€

[TF_caster robParticipant]

“Without the public sector Rob you would not enjoy the life you do.”

You’re assuming that I enjoy it?

As for banks, problem is, the government has no leverage over the banks.

The only chance was for Brown & Darling to add some conditions when they handed the money over. As they failed to do this it’s bolting horses and stable-doors now.

I honestly think Brown had been seduced by the tax-revenue he’d gorged on for the previous eleven years and even he knew deep-down that he couldn’t continue to keep throwing money at his pet-projects without the tax bonanza that the banks had provided him with in the past.

That’s why he went for a short-term fix, broke the monopoly rules and started printing money which will lead to high inflation somewhere down the line.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@eels wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@eels wrote:

Second, What right does the public sector have to be ‘bailed out’ to the tune of £180bn this year, £180bn last year, £150bn next year and so on? In fact, what right does the public sector have to burden me and the rest of the future of this country with billions of pounds of debt every single year? Every sector needs to be self-sufficient in the long term, whether it is retail, construction, financial services or governement. ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap

Eels, do you not think it is an oxymoron that a member of the banking sector made that statement?

Strikes me most people have no idea what the public sector is or how vital it has been/is in their lives. I blame the teachers personally.

No i don’t think it’s an oxymoron.

What i do find strange is that every one wants to blaim only the bankers.I would of thought the fact the previous government were spending £4 for every £3 that came in to the coffers might also have some thing to do with our current situation??

Please tell me you are not a banker too Eel. How can Gary a member of the profession that created this mess then lecture and complain to the rest of us. Personally, I am deeply offended by Gary and Rob.

My good lady is petrified she will lose her job as a nurse. She was educated privately paid for by the hard work of her parents. In 20+ years she has helped to save the lives of 00’s possibly 000’s of babies/young infants. She has never had a credit card, never been in debt, she will not even make an online transaction, she has funded several courses from her own income and is fantastically well qualified]a near bankrupt Banking system[/b] Yes to me and many, it seems strange that state owned banks such as RBS can maintain a bonus pool of £1.3 billion when large swathes of the population are nervous over whether they will have a job in the next twelve months, and face no prospect of the government bailing them out.

The public is justifiably angry that a full range of politicians have said they will tackle the excessive bonus culture within the banks, yet do nothing. Yet the reality is that the enormous bonus payments are merely an extension of the enormous revenues generated by the banks. The real question is over the legality/appropriateness of these revenues. The deal makers, traders and derivative salesmen who have transformed the banking industry from conservative managers of capital to aggressive creators of credit (money) and all manner of complex gambling instruments (derivatives).

So perhaps you can see why I describe such statements as oxymorons. The sheer stupidity is that when the Robs & Garys cry make the cuts, cut, cut and cut it won’t be the people they want rid of who get the boot (the public sector Gary’s make the decisions) but it will be the nurses, the police officers on the beat, the basic soldiers. So when your family get poorer medical care and possibly die, when your family members get assaulted / raped or murdered remember that the Rob’s, Gary’s and Eels LOL and cheered as Bob Diamond received his 8 million bonus. You reap what you sow boys.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@caster rob wrote:

“Without the public sector Rob you would not enjoy the life you do.”

You’re assuming that I enjoy it?

As for banks, problem is, the government has no leverage over the banks.

The only chance was for Brown & Darling to add some conditions when they handed the money over. As they failed to do this it’s bolting horses and stable-doors now.

I honestly think Brown had been seduced by the tax-revenue he’d gorged on for the previous eleven years and even he knew deep-down that he couldn’t continue to keep throwing money at his pet-projects without the tax bonanza that the banks had provided him with in the past.

That’s why he went for a short-term fix, broke the monopoly rules and started printing money which will lead to high inflation somewhere down the line.

It would be even less enjoyable Rob and just remember some people do not even get a choice to decide.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

https://www.total-fishing.com/forum.aspx?g=posts&t=35103

Gary, Eel, Rob make a donation. It will make you feel better ~think

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Love them or hate them this was something good New Labour did

Pregnancies in girls under 18 in England and Wales have fallen to levels not seen since the early 1980s, according to new government figures.

The actual number of conceptions in under 18s was 38,259 compared with 41,361 in 2008, a decline of 7.5%. Nearly half of these conceptions led to abortions.

In 2006 I worked with a 15 year old girl who I managed to convince to have her 3rd abortion and to have the contraceptive implant. Gary and Rob would be proud of me

Here is the ‘irony’

But they still fall well short of a target set by the previous Labour government in 1998, now abandoned by the Coalition, to cut teenage pregnancies by 50% by 2010.

I think reducing tennage pregnancy is a great thing, but Rob, Gary and the Coalition might say whoa that is the nanny state gone too far. So the next time a single mum of a silly age is ‘enjoying’ her benefit life. Remember Rob abd Gary you reap what you sow. Nevertheless, as long as we do not have the nanny state who cares lol

[TF_eels]

The name is eels.

No i’m not a banker, far from it.
I work in a industry where the cuts have had a big impact. The company i work for made 30% redundancies last year.

I have not said i agree with the bonus culture of the banks or the bailing out. But what really bothers me is that ALL the blame is on the bankers and that does not seem fair to me.
I’ll say it AGAIN if you spend £4 for every £3 that comes in surely that is going to become a problem at some point. Also when times were good why didn’t they put any money away for a rainy day???

The previous goverment were like some of the banks, lending/spending what they didn’t have.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@eels wrote:

The name is eels.

No i’m not a banker, far from it.
I work in a industry where the cuts have had a big impact. The company i work for made 30% redundancies last year.

I have not said i agree with the bonus culture of the banks or the bailing out. But what really bothers me is that ALL the blame is on the bankers and that does not seem fair to me.
I’ll say it AGAIN if you spend £4 for every £3 that comes in surely that is going to become a problem at some point. Also when times were good why didn’t they put any money away for a rainy day???

The previous goverment were like some of the banks, lending/spending what they didn’t have.

Sorry Eels

Some would argue we had no choice but to help the banks and morally I think we should have helped them but when you help somebody you would then expect them to return the favour. That is not happening. Indeed, it is vile the let them eat cake attitude of our banking sector and the turn a blind eye unfilled promises of our government. The previous governments (Conservative and New Labour) were no better. 5 years before the MP expenses scandal broke a female civil servant warned MPs what they were doing was wrong, She was run out of her job by Labour Ministers. Our poilticians are incredibly pure but maybe we got what we deserved. Gary and Rob are creations of a society that decided greed is good and to hell with anybody or anything else.

We all have debt Eels. Business functions on debt. Only Islam bans interest, credit creation, gambling, short selling, futures trading, manipulation of markets with derivatives and bailing out of failed banks. Bonuses are optional, but only for legal work. Not sure I want to convert, do you?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

Gary / Rob I expect you to have both made a donation BTW It’s not the nanny state BTW, just people helping other people out when tragedy strikes ~think

[TF_caster robParticipant]

“Here is the ‘irony’

Quote:
But they still fall well short of a target set by the previous Labour government in 1998, now abandoned by the Coalition, to cut teenage pregnancies by 50% by 2010.”

And we all know that the previous labour government NEVER missed a target it had set itself, don’t we?

Here’s the rest of the irony:

If the welfare state had never made illegitimate child-birth a career-choice by providing free accomodation, money and other benefits for morally deficient females at taxpayers expense, pregnancies in girls under 18 would have been much less likely to have reached the figures that they did.

Remembering that we reap what we sow is damned fine advice and I hope it is taken on board.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

Just when the exchanges become worthwhile you spout shite like this:

“Gary and Rob are creations of a society that decided greed is good and to hell with anybody or anything else.”

Goodnight.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@caster rob wrote:

“Here is the ‘irony’

Quote:
But they still fall well short of a target set by the previous Labour government in 1998, now abandoned by the Coalition, to cut teenage pregnancies by 50% by 2010.”

And we all know that the previous labour government NEVER missed a target it had set itself, don’t we?

Here’s the rest of the irony:

If the welfare state had never made illegitimate child-birth a career-choice by providing free accomodation, money and other benefits for morally deficient females at taxpayers expense, pregnancies in girls under 18 would have been much less likely to have reached the figures that they did.

Remembering that we reap what we sow is damned fine advice and I hope it is taken on board.

Very true but it started to become a real issue under your heroine, Margaret.

Just like the bankers, teenage mums have us by the short and curlys. Oddly though I found you could persuade such people not to if they thought life could offer them something better. The girl with 3 abortions at 15 was potentially an University student. The likelihood is she never will be. I walked away from that sector when I realised the real issue was at the higher decision making levels.

If people think something is worth making the effort for then they will. If they see no hope, nothing gained from their effort then boy you are in trouble.

You are a victim Rob. So is Gary. It’s nothing to be ashamed of. Indeed, you can blame so many other people.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@caster rob wrote:

Just when the exchanges become worthwhile you spout shite like this:

“Gary and Rob are creations of a society that decided greed is good and to hell with anybody or anything else.”

Goodnight.

Don’t forget your donation 😛 😉

[TF_herbie]

@eels wrote:

Second, What right does the public sector have to be ‘bailed out’ to the tune of £180bn this year, £180bn last year, £150bn next year and so on? In fact, what right does the public sector have to burden me and the rest of the future of this country with billions of pounds of debt every single year? Every sector needs to be self-sufficient in the long term, whether it is retail, construction, financial services or governement. ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap

quite right eels. close the hospitals,schools,nursing homes,doctors surgery,s,c.i.b,s,highway authority,s, armed forces, midwives , carers, stop all benifits/pensions, no more free dentists for children, eye tests stop them, public buildings should be sold off today, no more road tax or any tax , get rid of those public insitutions as well. no more funding for charities, or oversee,s aid. close all local authorities, sack the dustmen , road sweepers,maintenance men. at the drop of a hat we have reduced the public sector to zero. yes people will die. good reduce the population. people will starve. not a bad thing realy it will make them more subserviant. but we will have no public debt. hang on a minute weve solved the banking problem at a stroke. no one has any money so we dont need banks. quite right eels why should we be burdened by public secter debt. bit like the 12th century init.
son we provide these services to those less well off than we are because we care. the fact that people are now taking the piss out of the system is due to weak government over the past 30 years. remove those who have no right being here and stop all immigration would be a good place to start the road to recovery. leaving the EU would be another. followed by NATO. bring all our troops home today.how many nurses jobs could we fund just by dropping the human rights act??.oversee,s aid should be stopped altogether let the african leaders buy there own arms. none of the above will ever happen . why! because its the banks and MP,s gravy train. imagine this country and all other like minded country,s stopping the need to borrow. who do you think would suffer the most.
A. the people.
B. the bankers.

[TF_Gary]

NWCA, as I previously stated, I only moved into banking in 2010, so you should probably re-consider / withdraw some of your remarks.

I also posted on the thread asking for donations with constructive advice, which, if used effectively, will be worth thousands – not the odd quid here or there. This embodies my philosophy of “hand ups, not hand outs”.

Based on what I have read, you have not actually addressed any counter arguments or presented any hard facts. You have just unleashed an emotive anti-banker diatribe. For example, can you please explain to me what Bob Diamond getting an £8m bonus has to do with families getting poorer medical care? Hint: Of Bob Diamond’s £8m bonus, over half will end up in HMRC’s coffers.

I agree that reducing teenage pregnancy is a good thing, but I do not believe that the government setting a spurious top down target furthers that very meaningful and proper objective.

Here’s another fact that you might not like – you think the public sector ‘cuts’ are going to be bad? Check out how many people Lloyds Banking Group have made redundant since 2007. It will make any public sector restraint look like a drop in the ocean. Public sector workers enjoyed boom time pay rises in 2008 and 2009 when the private sector was on its knees. To use your words, you reap what you sow. And it is pay back time for years of public sector excess.

As I have said repeatedly, I refuse to dabble in the politics of the situation. I would rather deal in facts than rhetoric.

The frustrating thing is that I agree with you on quite a few points. In context of the following (your words), refer back to my earlier remarks on this thread about incentive structures:
“If people think something is worth making the effort for then they will. If they see no hope, nothing gained from their effort then boy you are in trouble.”

herbie, don’t believe everything that you read in the Mirror about government spending cuts.

[TF_Rad]

the rich just keep getting richer~naughty the poor just keep getting poorer~naughty and the working class just keep getting shit on~think ~think about sums the situation up in short

[TF_Gary]

So Rad, should we have a system that allows the poor to become rich? Or should we just drag everyone down to the lowest common denominator?

[TF_Gary]

Look what you are driving these people to:

Banker To Go On Hunger Strike Over Bonus

A banker at a top City firm is to go on hunger strike over his 2010 bonus payout.
The banker, who does not wish to be identified at this stage as he intends to surprise his firm with his protest later this week, told Here is The City: ‘I haven’t actually been told what my bonus was for last year yet, but I’m expecting the worst’.

‘My three-year guarantee ran off last year’, he explained, ‘And I haven’t been around much this year. I haven’t done any deals over the last 12 months – in fact, I’ve haven’t actually done any deals since I joined. So, in truth, I expect to be flat on last year at best, which just isn’t going to be enough for someone with my proven track record’.

The banker has been in training now for several week, putting on almost 70lb in the process. ‘This is probably going to be the toughest thing I’ve ever done’, he said, ‘So I’m determined to build in some extra fat to give me a bit to play with’.

‘I’m doing this for the industry’, he continued, ‘As I’m fed up with everyone else protesting about us bankers, and our pay and everything. It’s about time one of us stood up and protested back. Now is the time, and I am that person’.

‘I haven’t yet decided exactly where I’m actually going to stage the hunger strike’, he explained, ‘But we think the company canteen is the best place. I want to be somewhere on bank premises where I won’t be tempted to break my fast – and, believe me, you wouldn’t want to eat anything they serve up at that place!’.

The banker says that he wants to send a strong message to bank management: ‘I’m starting Thursday’, he said, ‘And will do everything in my power to try and hold out for as long as I can……..at least until the weekend anyway’.

[TF_lloydy1970]

Eels is the most sensible person on here

[TF_lloydy1970]

A question out of curiosity.
was Thatcher totally to blame for the pits or was scargill as bad or worse?

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@caster rob wrote:

Just when the exchanges become worthwhile you spout shite like this:

“Gary and Rob are creations of a society that decided greed is good and to hell with anybody or anything else.”

Goodnight.

Don’t forget your donation 😛 ]

I haven’t.

That’s £5 of mine they’ll never have – thanks to you.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

A question out of curiosity.
was Thatcher totally to blame for the pits or was scargill as bad or worse?

What do you mean by “blame for the pits”?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@caster rob wrote:

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@caster rob wrote:

Just when the exchanges become worthwhile you spout shite like this:

“Gary and Rob are creations of a society that decided greed is good and to hell with anybody or anything else.”

Goodnight.

Don’t forget your donation 😛 ]

I haven’t.

That’s £5 of mine they’ll never have – thanks to you.

Lol Rob you had not intention of donating. Let’s not pretend. It would go against your ideology. You would argue it served them right and it is a cruel world, survival of the fittest etc etc.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

A question out of curiosity.
was Thatcher totally to blame for the pits or was scargill as bad or worse?

Thatcher in the main Lloydy. Scargill was in part to blame.

I find it hypocritical that our politicians are supporting civil unrest in the Middle East and deploring any use of force against protestors yet they belong to a Political Party that endorsed / advocated brutaily against striking miners and reacted in shock / horror that some students recently upset Charles and Camila. What do you think Lloydy?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

@Gary wrote:

Look what you are driving these people to:

Banker To Go On Hunger Strike Over Bonus

A banker at a top City firm is to go on hunger strike over his 2010 bonus payout.
The banker, who does not wish to be identified at this stage as he intends to surprise his firm with his protest later this week, told Here is The City: ‘I haven’t actually been told what my bonus was for last year yet, but I’m expecting the worst’.

‘My three-year guarantee ran off last year’, he explained, ‘And I haven’t been around much this year. I haven’t done any deals over the last 12 months – in fact, I’ve haven’t actually done any deals since I joined. So, in truth, I expect to be flat on last year at best, which just isn’t going to be enough for someone with my proven track record’.

The banker has been in training now for several week, putting on almost 70lb in the process. ‘This is probably going to be the toughest thing I’ve ever done’, he said, ‘So I’m determined to build in some extra fat to give me a bit to play with’.

‘I’m doing this for the industry’, he continued, ‘As I’m fed up with everyone else protesting about us bankers, and our pay and everything. It’s about time one of us stood up and protested back. Now is the time, and I am that person’.

‘I haven’t yet decided exactly where I’m actually going to stage the hunger strike’, he explained, ‘But we think the company canteen is the best place. I want to be somewhere on bank premises where I won’t be tempted to break my fast – and, believe me, you wouldn’t want to eat anything they serve up at that place!’.

The banker says that he wants to send a strong message to bank management: ‘I’m starting Thursday’, he said, ‘And will do everything in my power to try and hold out for as long as I can……..at least until the weekend anyway’.

Not funny in present circumstances and just an example as why bankers are now held in such low esteem.

[TF_herbie]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

A question out of curiosity.
was Thatcher totally to blame for the pits or was scargill as bad or worse?

thats a dam good question lloydy~clap ask yourself did scargill have the power to close a pit~think or was it thatcher~think .

did she with the help of murdoch and his media empire conspire to defeat the unions with negative propaganda.
Mmmmmm let me see. they defeated the print unions and allowed the fat bastard to steal the pension fund ( sorry cant bring myself to utter his vile name)from redwood press.

they defeated the rail unions and privatised the railways ~think well we gave the new owners lots of public funds which by the way they kept.

she closed down profitable pits and chose to buy polish coal at a higher cost if you factor in unemployment and loss of tax revenue from the miners.

she destroyed our car industry at a stroke with lack of investment and then made it red robbo,s fault. even though most of the strikes were provoked by renaging on agreememnts. knowing full well the men would strike and therefor giving them an excuse to shut it down.

chose to have korean subsidised shipyards build our ships when the e/u banned us from subsidising our own. and then shut them down en mass.

but most of all and its the one thing future generations will judge her on. she allowed foreign investers to buy british firms/ close them/move them abroad, and then import the same goods british workers made at the same cost to the public. without a levy . do you think the americans would allow that.

so to answer your question lloydy yes it was scargills fault for guessing the future —- correctly, and asking his men to fight for there jobs/family,s/ there futures.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@herbie wrote:

@lloydy1970 wrote:

A question out of curiosity.
was Thatcher totally to blame for the pits or was scargill as bad or worse?

thats a dam good question lloydy~clap ask yourself did scargill have the power to close a pit~think or was it thatcher~think .

did she with the help of murdoch and his media empire conspire to defeat the unions with negative propaganda.
Mmmmmm let me see. they defeated the print unions and allowed the fat bastard to steal the pension fund ( sorry cant bring myself to utter his vile name)from redwood press.

they defeated the rail unions and privatised the railways ~think well we gave the new owners lots of public funds which by the way they kept.

she closed down profitable pits and chose to buy polish coal at a higher cost if you factor in unemployment and loss of tax revenue from the miners.

she destroyed our car industry at a stroke with lack of investment and then made it red robbo,s fault. even though most of the strikes were provoked by renaging on agreememnts. knowing full well the men would strike and therefor giving them an excuse to shut it down.

chose to have korean subsidised shipyards build our ships when the e/u banned us from subsidising our own. and then shut them down en mass.

but most of all and its the one thing future generations will judge her on. she allowed foreign investers to buy british firms/ close them/move them abroad, and then import the same goods british workers made at the same cost to the public. without a levy . do you think the americans would allow that.

so to answer your question lloydy yes it was scargills fault for guessing the future —- correctly, and asking his men to fight for there jobs/family,s/ there futures.

Very long-winded joke there.

Succinctly, it was due to weak management, closed-shop, union dominated, inefficient working practices and unsustainable pay-levels against dwindling productivity that exported the UK’s manufacturing base over a 30+ year period.

Pity Labour only had thirteen years and a thriving economic base to redress this situation, they must have got side-tracked.

Re: Scargill.

In his speeches he regularly used to say that mining was a dirty and dangerous occupation and he longed for the day when no man went down a mine to earn a living. That being so he should have ended up pretty pleased all round, especially with him acquiring an extremely large house in the countryside outside Worsborough thanks to a very favourable loan from the International Miners Organisation and contributions from Gaddafi, of all people.

What a small world it is.

[TF_lloydy1970]

@caster rob wrote:

@lloydy1970 wrote:

A question out of curiosity.
was Thatcher totally to blame for the pits or was scargill as bad or worse?

What do you mean by “blame for the pits”?

Miners strikes and shutting of mines

[TF_lloydy1970]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

@lloydy1970 wrote:

A question out of curiosity.
was Thatcher totally to blame for the pits or was scargill as bad or worse?

Thatcher in the main Lloydy. Scargill was in part to blame.

I find it hypocritical that our politicians are supporting civil unrest in the Middle East and deploring any use of force against protestors yet they belong to a Political Party that endorsed / advocated brutaily against striking miners and reacted in shock / horror that some students recently upset Charles and Camila. What do you think Lloydy?

I think that world politics is now so corrupt there’s no going back, it’s all about money and power. How many really agreed with Iraq war or how many really agree with mass immigration or the stupid human rights law that allows someone that has performed treason against this country to be treated better than law abiding citizens. They’re all that afraid of losing their seats or being classed as racists that they will go along with what they are told. Where i have more respect for Thatcher is that i believe that whatever she did she thought she was doing the right thing. I think that British industry was brought down by idealistic views of unions and workers. We couldn’t carry on with 1 man 1 job with the progress that was going on all over the world, i worked at a factory where they changed from manual labour to robot but still had 1 man for each machine where as developing country’s had 2 machines per man, it’s not hard to work out that if you aren’t competitive that sooner or later somethings going to happen. Every car factory i worked at(mostly as a service contractor)there were people walking around doing nothing day in day out, now if you had a decorating firm and you had 10 employees but only 5 were working your company wouldn’t last very long. I think as a nation we think we are better than anyone else and the world owes us a living. Took my car to a car wash with eastern european workers the other week, most of our youth would refuse to work as hard as they did and it hurts to say that.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

So much truth in what you say Lloydy in that post.

I personally think Thatcher and those thereafter are the mirror image of the greedy, self serving union leaders / workers of the 1970’s. Both equally bad.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

So much truth in what you say Lloydy in that post.

I personally think Thatcher and those thereafter are the mirror image of the greedy, self serving union leaders / workers of the 1970’s. Both equally bad.

That would be one of the mirrors in the Fun House?

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

~clap Rob

Now get donating you miserable sod 🙂

[TF_herbie]

so easy to concentrate on what murdoch/tories tell you about unions. what about the good things they’ve done. the workplace is safer ( when we had workplaces that is ) do you think the bosses would have done that without the unions. my pension is terrific . do you actualy think the word pension would exsist without unions. sick pay well of course the bosses would have given you that. reasonable working hours. before unions 6am to 7pm was normal. child labour. how many sweat shops can you now find in the workplace ~think none, ask yourself , did the MP,s/bosses do away with child labour. not a chance. i was about to say workers rights but the torries chucked them out years ago.now a boss can ask you to re apply for your job , then chuck you out without redress. thats what not having a balance between unions and bosses does, it creates injustice. all these things the gutless meme,s of today take for granted had to be won by the very unions you today despise (mainly cos murdoch told you to). remember these words.
UNITY IS STRENTH. one day todays workers will grow some testicles and redress the balance.

[TF_Gary]

As I said on the other thread, I will say no more on this topic. All I ask is that you reflect on the contents of the thread and the fact that the only person who has actually suggested concrete steps to address the issues in the banking sector (higher taxes to reflect implicit guarantee on institutions presenting systemic risk, amnesty on tax offset of losses incurred during the crisis and encouraging more people to move into banking sector to drive down remuneration) rather than just applying generic banker bashing diatribe is yours truly. I was on the other side until a few months ago and have only recently moved into banking, so feel as though I have a very strong grasp on how to tackle the problems. I am only sorry that you do not care to listen or understand.

Enjoy casting around your naive, unconstructive opprobrium.

Gary

[TF_lloydy1970]

@herbie wrote:

so easy to concentrate on what murdoch/tories tell you about unions. what about the good things they’ve done. the workplace is safer ( when we had workplaces that is ) do you think the bosses would have done that without the unions. my pension is terrific . do you actualy think the word pension would exsist without unions. sick pay well of course the bosses would have given you that. reasonable working hours. before unions 6am to 7pm was normal. child labour. how many sweat shops can you now find in the workplace ~think none, ask yourself , did the MP,s/bosses do away with child labour. not a chance. i was about to say workers rights but the torries chucked them out years ago.now a boss can ask you to re apply for your job , then chuck you out without redress. thats what not having a balance between unions and bosses does, it creates injustice. all these things the gutless meme,s of today take for granted had to be won by the very unions you today despise (mainly cos murdoch told you to). remember these words.
UNITY IS STRENTH. one day todays workers will grow some testicles and redress the balance.

Of course unions did lots of good things, I wouldn’t question that but they became too powerful and like everybody with power it went to their head. They never realised that the world was changing and that companies and workers had no choice but to change with them, we went from overworked and underpaid to walking around doing nothing for good wages. When I worked at trw valves it was the easiest and best paid job I’d had, you were paid if off sick, if your wife had a baby flowers were sent and if anyone had personal problems they did their best to help but all the people who’d been there for years complained how bad they were treated, I couldn’t believe it.

If labour hadn’t invented all these guardian jobs for the boys then maybe the frontline spending cuts wouldn’t be needed.
Last point, if labour look like winning next election Murdoch will neon their side just like 1997

[TF_wightangler]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2011/feb/24/rbs-bankers-bonuses-despite-loss

[TF_herbie]

absolutely agree lloydy some individual unions got too big for there own good and didnt the state/murdoch media concentrate on them. whilst all the time other unions got on with the job of protecting there employee,s and at the same time accepting working practice changes, they never got a mention. i worked in the rubber/tyre industry for 20 years and never spent one day on strike.in fact as a paying union member for 40 years , NUR, T&GWU, UNISON. i have never taken industrial action not even once. but maggie was quick to label us with the general public through murdoch as did blair again through murdoch. this was of course smoke and mirrors. a way of diverting the people attention from the real adgenda, selling off the country,s crown jewels to foreign investment by the time people cottened on it was too late, only the post office and the NHS remained. these you will notice are now being privatised through the back door by cameron, who needs funds donated badly. just imagine how much revenue weve lost by just privatising the gas/water . gas alone this year 750 million all going elsewhere. and i havnt mentionrd BT% electricity. imagine the size of our deficit with the profits from these utilities going into the coffers.
there was a saying during WW1. ” LIONS LED BY DONKEYS” this is still true today as it was then.

[TF_Dodge]

Dave (Lloydy).

Murdochs empire looks to be in big trouble mate. The News of The World phone tapping scandal will change everything pretty soon and the minute Coulson gets arrested Cameron is in serious poo poo !

Oh and its trade union marching season in a couple of weeks ~clap ~clap

Stand tall BROTHERS ! ~clap ~clap x

[TF_lloydy1970]

Dodge, the only reason you don’t hear more dirt is that there’s so much of it in all the party’s. I’ll still stick to the cons, in my opinion less chance of us becoming a 3rd world country under them and I’d much rather have someone running my country with business sense than someone who if they ran household like country would be filing for bankruptcy

[andy jonesParticipant]

It finally looks like were paying the price for Maggies failed policies of the 80’s.
As an ex-miner my fight along with many other miners during the strike was the preservation of jobs and an industry we could now well do with.

[TF_fishcatcher4]

@lloydy1970 wrote:

Dodge, the only reason you don’t hear more dirt is that there’s so much of it in all the party’s. I’ll still stick to the cons, in my opinion less chance of us becoming a 3rd world country under them and I’d much rather have someone running my country with business sense than someone who if they ran household like country would be filing for bankruptcy

who in the tory party has business sense.they are all straight out of eton or were living off mummy or daddies money or married to someone whose family has money.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

We must be the biggest mugs in the world

Operating profits at British Gas rose 24% in 2010 to £742m, its parent company Centrica has said.

[TF_lloydy1970]

@andy jones wrote:

It finally looks like were paying the price for Maggies failed policies of the 80’s.
As an ex-miner my fight along with many other miners during the strike was the preservation of jobs and an industry we could now well do with.

Still Maggie’s fault 25 years on yet after less than 12 months its Cameron’s fault, oh how you make me laugh, and after Tories rein in 1997, the country is in the best position it has been in for years. If you can’t see the damage Blair and brown did to this country then it just shows how blinkered you are. Yes I did like Maggie, yes I do think she dropped some right clangers, but in my opinion the difference between her and the other 2 is she thought she was doing the right thing where Blair was doing it for himself.

[TF_lloydy1970]

@NW Cut Angler wrote:

We must be the biggest mugs in the world

Operating profits at British Gas rose 24% in 2010 to £742m, its parent company Centrica has said.

Totally agree, the French who we call yellow would be putting up a much better fight than us and over fuel.

[TF_NW Cut Angler]

I think it is hard when you come from mining stock (I do) to have any respect for Thatcher. However, I also believe that Scargill made some glaring errors.

My way of thinking is that the 70’s was a bizarre decade with global issues but we became complacent and short sighted as a nation and some not all union officials got greedy and stupid. Thereafter, I do not care who was in power money / wealth was wasted time and time again. That money / wealth was not infinite and alongside policies like escalating property values was used to paper over the cracks. Is there a great difference between Thatcher and Blair or Clegg/Cameron ? All played a game and we took the bait like the suicidal greedy first fish of the match. We even have the odd person who still thinks what is happening now and in the last 3 decades was fine and dandy.

Will the British people ever stand up again and be counted or have we lost the will to fight.

[TF_herbie]

so there i am looking through my morning pack of lies and behold
. RBS to pay 100 million bonuses after loosing 1.1 BILLION . CHRIST ALMIGHTY i could get 100 children from our nursery to lose 1.1 billion fo nothing. we must as tax payers be so used to being shafted we no longer notice.
ask your self one simple question. which firm ( apart from B/A) in the whole of the world could lose that much money and still continue to trade. would you lend them money??? we did~sick ~sick ~sick ~sick ~sick ~sick ~sick ~sick ~sick STUPID IS AS STUPID DOES thats us . mind you i expect they earned there bonus what with long hours and only 6 weeks spent skiing. poor lambs.

[TF_toplights]

I dont usually reply to off topic posts but,i’m with you all the way Herbie.Modern workers have a lot to thank the old trade unionists for.Where would they be today, without them.I agree with posters who say that, in the end unions plotted there own downfall.I was a trade union member most of my life and that included when i was foreman,and proud to be so.

[TF_Dodge]

Useless , clueless , gutless ConDem government the last western government to get its workers out of Libya , cameron is somewhere in the middle east selling arms , Clegg has koofed off on a sking holiday when he should be in England , defence minister Liam Fox spent the day in the pub and William Hague doesnt know what day it is ! Absolute disgrace ~naughty ~naughty

Bet if Lord Snobberry of Snobberryshire was stuck in Libya he would be out in no time ! ~sick

[TF_herbie]

quite right andy there was unions and unions. it seemed to be the bigger they were the worse they got. they along with the tories were resposable for the destruction of heavy industry. problem we now have the leaders of this country bailing out a bunch of losers, who gambled like a blind man after 12 hrs in the pub. what they should have done is let the banks fail, and instead look inwards and rebuild the nation. yes i know it would have been bloody hard , but at least we the people would have had something to work towards. now we have zero. sooner rather than later these greedy shysters will be off to asia and we will be stuffed. my worry is for my grandchildrens future.will they have to be raised in what is fast becoming a third world country.

[TF_caster robParticipant]

@ herbie:

“what they should have done is let the banks fail, and instead look inwards and rebuild the nation”

Well, at least we agree on something, and I said so at the time.

[TF_toplights]

Herbieeee,Who’s Andy?~think ~clap ~clap ~clap

[TF_dingdong]

spend spend spend
money money money
~clap ~clap ~clap ~clap

Would like to thank you all for making us rich,
from Gordon&Tony from the labour party
lol .great post Herbie

[Author]

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